SEXISM THAT SHE HAS EXPERIENCED IN THE ENTERTAINMENT

INDUSTRY. THIS IS A RESPONSE TO THE SONY EMAIL HACK THAT

HAPPENED LAST YEAR, AND SHE WANTED TO MAKE THE CASE THAT A

LOT OF WOMEN IN THE ENTERTAINMENT INDUSTRY DON'T

NECESSARILY GET PAID THE SAME AS THEIR MALE COUNTERPARTS, AND IT

MAY NOT HAVE TO DO WITH SEXISM,

IT MAY HAVE TO DO WITH HOW WOMEN NEGOTIATE THEIR PAY FOR THESE

PARTS. YOU CAN FIND THESE ON LENA DUNHAM'S BLOG, LENNY,

WHICH TALKS ABOUT SEXISM AND THINGS LIKE THAT.

JENNIFER LAWRENCE WRITES,

"WHEN THE SONY EMAIL HACK HAPPENED AND I FOUND OUT HOW

MUCH LESS I WAS GETTING PAID

THAN MY MALE COSTARS, I DIDN'T GET MAD AT SONY, I GOT MAD AT

MYSELF. I FAILED AS A NEGOTIATOR BECAUSE I GAVE UP

EARLY. I DID NOT WANT TO KEEP FIGHTING OVER MILLIONS OF

DOLLARS THAT, FRANKLY, DUE TO TWO MOVIE FRANCHISES, I DID NOT

NEED." CHERYL SANDBERG GOT A LOT OF HEAT FOR THIS WHEN SHE

MENTIONED IT IN HER BOOK, WOMEN

FEEL UNCOMFORTABLE NEGOTIATING THEIR SALARIES, AND TALKING

ABOUT MONEY. I KNOW IT FROM FIRST-HAND EXPERIENCE. YOU

DON'T WANT TO SEEM TOO AGGRESSIVE OR UNLIKABLE, OR

SOMEONE WHO IS BEING A BRAT OR BEING GREEDY. MEN TEND TO BE

MUCH BETTER AT NEGOTIATING THEIR SALARIES BECAUSE THEY HAVE BEEN

TOLD THAT THEY ARE ENTITLED TO MORE MONEY. WOMEN HAVE BEEN

TOLD OVER AND OVER AGAIN, YOU NEED TO BE LIKABLE.

SO DON'T BE TOO AGGRESSIVE.

I ONLY HALF AGREE WITH THAT. I FEAR THAT IT

OVERGENERALIZE. I HAVE

BEEN ON BOTH SIDES OF THIS, AND YES, SOMETIMES MEN ARE MORE

ASSERTIVE. NOBODY EVER THINKS, OH WHAT A BITCH.

THEY THINK HE IS A STRONG. WHAT A STRONG MAN.

RIGHT, SO I GET THAT. AT THE SAME TIME, THERE'S A LOT OF GUYS

WHO ARE WORRIED ABOUT ASKING FOR

MORE MONEY.

I WOULD SAY MORE OFTEN THAT IS THE CASE THEN A GUY COMES

IN AND IS LIKE, I WANT MORE MONEY.

BECAUSE WE ARE ALL HUMAN BEINGS, WE ARE LIKE, IS THAT TOO RUDE?

IS THAT TOO MUCH?

I DON'T KNOW, WHENEVER I HAVE BEEN ON THAT END OF THE

EQUATION, WHEN I AM ASKING FOR MONEY, I ALWAYS FEEL LIKE,

AM I ASKING FOR TOO MUCH?

IT'S THE MOST UNCOMFORTABLE THING. I DON'T THINK THAT

JENNIFER LAWRENCE IS SAYING THAT MEN ARE OVERALL BETTER

NEGOTIATORS, I JUST THINK THAT MEN TEND TO BE MORE COMFORTABLE

BEING ASSERTIVE; WHEREAS, WOMEN HAVE BEEN OPENLY CRITICIZED FOR

BEING TOO ASSERTIVE. I REMEMBER GETTING HIRED AS A FREELANCER TO

CONTRIBUTE FOR ANOTHER NETWORK, AND THEY ASKED ME WHAT I EXPECTED

TO GET PAID PER SEGMENT.

I ASKED STEVE OH WHAT I SHOULD GET PAID, AND I WAS THINKING ABOUT ASKING FOR

SOMETHING RIDICULOUSLY LOW, AND I REMEMBER THINKING THIS IS

BALLSY. I AM ASKING FOR A LOT

OF MONEY. STEVE WAS LIKE YOU NEED TO ASK FOR THREE TIMES THAT

AMOUNT. I WAS LIKE THEY ARE NOT GOING TO HIRE ME. WHEN ASKED

FOR THAT AMOUNT ñ FIRST OF ALL I GAVE THEM A LOW NUMBER AND A

HIGH NUMBER AND WAS LIKE, YOU

GUYS DECIDE. I AM THE WORST NEGOTIATOR.

THAT'S THE MOST CLEAR MISTAKE OF ALL TIME.

I WAS LIKE, IF I GIVE THEM TWO OPTIONS, I WON'T HAVE TO

WORRY ABOUT THEM NOT HIRING ME. THESE ARE THE THINGS THAT GO

THROUGH YOUR MIND. YOU ARE TOLD THAT BEING ASSERTIVE IS GOING TO

BE A BAD THING AND YOU WILL BE

LOOKED AT AS A BITCH.

YOU ARE TILTING THE SCALES AGAINST WOMEN BECAUSE OF SOME OF

THE PRECONCEIVED NOTIONS THAT WE HAVE PUT IN PEOPLE'S HEADS WITH

WOMEN AND MEN, BUT I AM TELLING YOU, OVERWHELMINGLY MY

EXPERIENCE IS THAT ASSERTIVE PEOPLE ARE UNCOMMON. THE MUCH

MORE COMMON THING FOR MEN AND

WOMEN IS TO WORRY ABOUT SEEMING LIKE YOU ARE ASKING FOR TOO

MUCH. AND CONTEXT MATTERS.

IF YOU ARE FROM THE IVY LEAGUE

SCHOOLS, IN MY EXPERIENCE, THEY

COME IN ASKING FOR EVERYTHING BECAUSE THEY ARE LIKE, WHAT YOU

MEAN? I AM GOD'S GIFT TO HUMANITY. I ASKED FOR THIS, OF

COURSE I SHOULD GET IT. BUT IF THE GUY WHO IS DOING MUCH BETTER

AND IS NOT FROM A GREAT SCHOOL,

CAN I GET THIS? RIGHT? IT IS NOT JUST A MAN AND WOMAN THING.

AND A LOT OF THE TIME PEOPLE COME IN AND ASK FOR TOTALLY

UNREASONABLE THINGS.

DO THEY?

DO PEOPLE COME IN AND PUT THEIR BALLS ON THE TABLE AND ARE

LIKE, HERE ARE MY BALLS?

I'M UNINTERESTED IN THEIR BALLS. IT HAPPENS, PEOPLE ASK

FOR TOO MUCH, I'VE ASKED FOR TOO MUCH, AND THEN YOU SAY IT IS NOT

REASONABLE, FUCK OFF. SO THERE IS SOMETHING LEGITIMATE TO WORRY

ABOUT, RIGHT?

IT IS A HUMAN THING MORE THAN ANYTHING ELSE, BUT YOU ARE

RIGHT, IT LEANS A LITTLE BIT MORE ñ ñ

IN FACT, IT IS NOT A DISADVANTAGE FOR WOMEN AS

MUCH AS IT IS A SLIGHT ADVANTAGE FOR MEN, BECAUSE SOME OF

THEM ARE TOLD THAT IT IS OKAY TO BE ASSERTIVE.

YES, FAIR ENOUGH. I WANT TO BE ABSOLUTELY CLEAR ABOUT ONE

THING, BECAUSE CONTEXT IS IMPORTANT IN THIS STORY. THAT

SONY HACK INDICATED THAT SHE WAS

GETTING PAID LESS IN A MOVIE ñ

AMERICAN HUSTLE ñ

YES, SHE WAS GETTING PAID LESS THAN HER MALE COSTARS

IN A MOVIE, BUT TO BE COMPLETELY FAIR TO SONY, HER EMPLOYERS,

IN THAT CASE, HER ROLE WASN'T AS BIG AS HER MALE COSTARS.

SHE WAS ALREADY GETTING PAID MILLIONS OF DOLLARS, IT'S

NOT LIKE THEY WERE PAYING HER $50,000

AND HER COSTARS WERE MAKING MILLIONS OF DOLLARS.

THE ROLE WASN'T THAT BIG. I'M BEING FAIR.

FUNNILY ENOUGH, I AM GOING TO SAY SOMETHING THAT SHE WAS

WORRIED ABOUT IN THE FIRST PLACE, I THINK SHE IS OVER

COMPLAINING A LITTLE BIT. NOT BECAUSE SHE MAKES MILLIONS OF

DOLLARS. I GET WHY SHE THINKS THAT LOOKS BAD, BUT YOU CAN'T

COMPLAIN, YOU JUST HAVE TO FIND WHAT THE MARKET IS. ALEX

RODRIGUEZ DOESN'T WORRY ABOUT BEING PAID TOO MUCH MONEY.

IT'S RIDICULOUS, BUT HE STILL GETS IT.

BUT HER ROLE WAS MUCH SMALLER THAN HER MALE COLLEAGUES IN

THAT PARTICULAR MOVIE.

I SAW THE MOVIE, THEIR ROLES WERE LARGER.

IF THE MOVIE WAS SILVER LININGS PLAYBOOK, AND

BRADLEY COOPER WAS MAKING WAY MORE MONEY THAN SHE WAS,

THEN WE ARE HAVING A CONVERSATION, BECAUSE HER

ROLE WAS JUST AS IMPORTANT IN THAT MOVIE.

EVEN SO, HE HAD THE THEORETICALLY MORE

CHALLENGING ROLE. I MEAN, WHATEVER.

I DISAGREE WITH THAT.

BECAUSE HE HAD A DISABILITY AND STUFF.

SO DID SHE.

HIS WAS A LITTLE BIT MORE MENTAL. ANYWAY, OKAY, OKAY.

ANYWAY, OVERALL I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU. AND FINALLY, THERE IS

ANOTHER PART WHERE I DISAGREE

WITH WHAT SHE SAID. SHE SAID THAT WHEN SHE WAS HAVING A

DISCUSSION WITH A MALE COLLEAGUE, SHE SAID SOMETHING

POLITE BUT NOT OVER THE TOP AND SUPER OFFENSIVE AND THE GUY TOOK

OFFENSE FROM IT.

SHE INTERPRETED IT AS, IF A GUY SAID THAT NOBODY WOULD THINK TWICE

ABOUT IT, WHEN I SAID IT, IT WAS, WHY ARE YOU BEING SO AGGRESSIVE?

SHE SAID I DON'T THINK I'VE EVER WORKED WITH A GUY WHO SPENT TIME

WORRYING ABOUT WHAT ANGLE TO USE WITH HIS TONE OF VOICE.

SHE HAS NEVER MET TOM HANK WHO USED TO WORK AT TYT,

HE THOUGHT A LOT ABOUT HOW HE WOULD COME OFF.

THAT IS PART OF MY POINT.

A LOT OF GUYS THINK, IN WORK SITUATIONS, WHAT IS THE

APPROPRIATE WAY TO SAY THIS?

SOME PEOPLE DON'T THINK ABOUT THE APPROPRIATE WAY TO SAY

THINGS, AND THEY OFTEN MAKE A MISTAKE.

I THINK YOU ARE RIGHT AND WRONG.

I THINK THAT THE WAY A WOMAN COMES OFF HURTS HER WAY

MORE THAN IT HURTS A MAN.

I DON'T THINK SO.

LET'S THINK ABOUT IT ON A MACRO SCALE WITH THE

PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION. THINK

ABOUT THE 2008 ELECTION, WITH THE WAY HILLARY CLINTON WAS

PERCEIVED AS COMPARED TO ANY MALE CANDIDATE. IT IS THE WAY THAT A

WOMAN COMES OFF IF SHE HAPPENS TO ACT THE SAME WAY THAT A MAN

ACTS. ON THIS VERY SHOW, GO TO ANY VIDEO WHERE A CENK AND I

DISAGREE ON SOMETHING. CENK IS

PASSIONATE. IF I GET HEATED ABOUT SOMETHING, I AM EMOTIONAL.

THOSE WORDS MATTER, THOSE PERCEPTIONS MATTER.

THERE IS DEFINITELY A DIFFERENCE.

ANA, I DON'T KNOW WHY YOU ARE GETTING SO EMOTIONAL. IF YOU COULD

JUST BRING DOWN THE SHRILLNESS FOR A SECOND.