キリスト教クロストーク「神は一人しかいない」｜三位一体論は主の御言葉に沿っているのか？ (Christian Crosstalk "There Is Only One God" | Is the Theory of Trinity in Line With the Lord's Word?)

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Living abroad in a country with religious freedom is really different!
We can have meetings and spread the gospel online.
- In the past, that was— - Li Rui! Li Rui!
There you are!
Did you see?
There's an uproar!
Where's the uproar?
There's an uproar in our church discussion group!
- Take a look at it! - An uproar in our group?
It looks like Brother Zhang posted a question and wants to discuss it with everyone.
Yes!
My goodness!
Does this look like a normal question?
Does the Trinity really exist?
Does it exist?
He's actually questioning the Trinity.
That's a serious issue!
And now everyone is posting responses!
Of course they are!
Look at this post.
"Are you serious?
We believe in the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.
Isn't that the Trinity?"
That's right.
"This is the foundation of our faith.
What gives you the self-confidence, or the courage, or the basis
to doubt the Trinity? Brother Zhang."
"What's going on here?
Brother Zhang has worked and preached for more than 30 years,
and he understands the Bible."
That's right.
"I don't know
how could he possibly doubt the Trinity?"
"Exactly.
Why? Brother Zhang,
why don't you believe in the existence of the Trinity?"
Even Brother Peter can't keep quiet.
It looks like Brother Chen is keeping his composure best.
"Everyone, take it easy,
you all need to simply calm down."
Well … this …
"Brother Zhang is a thoughtful and insightful person.
There must be a reason he posted this question."
I can't.
Hey, come back, come back!
Where are you going?
To ask Brother Zhang in person.
I want to ask him why he doubts the Trinity.
This is …
Oh!
Then don't bother going.
Huh?
I already went and asked him.
Then hurry up and tell me what's going on here!
It was the first thing I asked him.
Brother Zhang,
our pastor has told us since childhood that God is a Trinity—
The pastor has told us that since he was a child?
Since we were children,
we've heard the pastor say that God is a Trinity.
Yes.
Have you forgotten that?
That's something everyone knows by heart!
"It's said
that over 300 years after the Lord came, at the Council of Nicaea,
religious leaders from every nation intensely debated whether God is One or a Trinity.
The Council ended without a result.
Later, after more than a century of hard, bitter debate,
the Trinitarian theory of God was finally settled upon,
and only then did it become the unshakable belief of Christianity."
You see?
Do you see?
Do you see how hard it was
for the religious leaders to come to an agreement on the Trinitarian theory?
Right.
- It was really, really hard! - Right.
So what did Brother Zhang have to say to that?
"Mm. Look!
It's a shame!"
What?
"It's a shame that the theory of God the religious leaders worked so hard to come up with
doesn't have any basis in the Lord Jesus' words."
It does not?
Does it?
Has the Lord Jesus ever said God is a Trinity?
The Lord Jesus …
Did He say it?
No, He didn't say it.
Then did the Holy Spirit say it?
Mm, no.
Did any prophets or apostles in the Bible ever testify that God is a Trinity?
No, they did not.
"There is only one true God.
God never said He is a Trinity,
and there is no record of it in the Bible,
so where does the religious world get the self-confidence, the courage, or the basis to insist
that God is a Trinity?"
We're back to his original question.
What matters is whether what Brother Zhang said is logical.
It may well be logical,
but the … the Trinitarian theory
didn't come out of nowhere.
It actually has a basis.
What is that basis?
Well,
Yeah!
You and I are like two peas in a pod.
Great minds think alike!
That's right!
The pastors and elders of the religious world
expounded the Trinitarian theory based on
the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit
mentioned in the Bible.
That's right!
He's playing our pastor now.
"Brothers and sisters,
let me explain why we say that God is a Trinity.
It is because God is composed of the three different persons
of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.
Right.
Each person contains God's complete divinity,
and they exist together as equals in one being.
That's right.
Even if the three persons which make up the Trinity are different,
they are still just one God, not three Gods."
If you said that to Brother Zhang, he would have been speechless, right?
Speechless, yes.
- Exactly right! - But I was speechless.
Huh?
You were the one speechless?
But …
Brother Li,
But did the Lord Jesus say that They are a Trinity?
Did He say that there are three persons in God?
No, He didn't.
But doesn't the idea of the Father, Son, and the Holy Spirit mean that?
Doesn't that prove that God is made up of three different persons?
If that's your logic then,
let me ask you:
Who is the Father?
Jehovah God!
Who is the Son?
The Lord Jesus!
And the Holy Spirit?
Ha!
The Holy Spirit is the Holy Spirit, that's …
Then is the Father the Holy Spirit?
Yes.
Is the Son's essence the Holy Spirit?
The Lord Jesus was conceived by the Holy Spirit,
so of course His essence was the Holy Spirit.
Then are the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit all the same Spirit?
They're obviously all one Spirit!
Then since They're one, why do we say They are three persons?
Surely three persons mean three separate Spirits?
But …
And three separate Spirits mean three separate Gods?
But …
And doesn't that contradict the fact that there is one true God?
Is this how Brother Zhang fellowshiped with you?
Hold on, I need a minute.
Think on it.
There is only one God,
and only one Holy Spirit.
Right.
God is a Trinity, so He is three persons.
Three persons mean three Gods.
And three Gods mean three Spirits.
That's not right.
One?
Three?
Three?
One?
Huh?
- Why is there a contradiction here? - You went from one God to three.
- Of course there's a contradiction! - This, this, this …
There can't be a contradiction.
And why is that?
It's true that there's only one God…
Right.
…however…
However …
…the one God is made up of three parts—
the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.
These three parts put together make the complete God,
and only that can be called God Himself.
Oh!
Yes!
If you had said that to Brother Zhang,
he would have been speechless!
That's exactly what I said to him!
Oh yeah?
And it was still me who was left speechless.
You see?
Wait, what?
What did he say that left you speechless again? This is …
"Brother Li,
there is only one God,
and God only has one Spirit.
According to the theory of the Trinity,
the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit each have Their own distinct essence
and each One is a distinct person,
which means that God is made up of three parts."
Yes.
"Doesn't that mean three Gods and three Spirits?
How could three separate Spirits join to become one?"
Just like the three cups of water can be poured into one,
the three Spirits can also join together.
Oh!
So the three Spirits can be poured together to make one just like three cups of water?
Is there any mistake in that understanding?
I wouldn't call it a mistake,
I'd call it complete nonsense!
Hey!
Aren't you turning God's Spirit into physical matter?
Can we just divide up and combine God's Spirit however we please?
But if we don't combine God's Spirits into one,
is He still the one true God?
Then by the theory of the Trinity,
all three have to be put together to be God.
So then, if They aren't put together,
They aren't God on Their own?
Well …
That …
Huh?
By the theory of the Trinity,
if we don't put Them together,
would that then mean that Jehovah God isn't the one true God?
That's …
According to the theory of the Trinity,
if we don't put Them together, the Holy Spirit isn't God?
According to the theory of the Trinity,
if we don't put Them together, Lord Jesus isn't God?
According to the theory of the Trinity—
Wait, wait, wait.
That's enough.
What's the matter?
Why is it that the more you talk, the more panicked I feel?
If we go by the theory of the Trinity,
it appears as if we're denying the one true God.
Isn't that exactly it?
The religious world separates God into three parts, three persons,
and then joins them into one being.
Isn't that dividing God?
Isn't that denying that God is the one true God?
Then that means the theory of the Trinity
really doesn't hold up?
Therefore,
when the religious community explains the Trinity with the Lord Jesus' words,
"baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit,"
they are misinterpreting the Lord's words.
I see …
Then can you please tell me how we should understand the Lord's words?
Actually,
in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit
is in the name of God.
Yes,
that's right.
Bluntly speaking,
the Son is God.
People can baptize directly in the Lord Jesus' name,
if they can accept this fact,
isn't that right?
Yes.
That's right.
But, at the time,
did people know the Lord Jesus was God?
No, they didn't.
They thought the Lord Jesus was a prophet.
That's right.
So, at the time, if people had been directly baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus,
would they have accepted it?
They probably wouldn't have.
Then there's your answer.
The Lord Jesus said that in consideration of people's immaturity and ignorance at the time,
to let people know that when they baptize,
they can do so in the name of the Father, the Son, or the Holy Spirit.
Baptizing in any one of God's names was acceptable.
But the Lord absolutely did not testify that God was a Trinity.
This fellowship is correct!
Is it possible that the theory of the Trinity isn't really true?
You got it?
Hold on!
What's the matter now?
But the Bible clearly states
that after the Lord Jesus was baptized, the heavens opened
and the Holy Spirit descended and landed on Him like a dove,
and a voice from the sky said:
The Holy Spirit testified that the Lord Jesus was God's beloved Son.
Doesn't that prove that the Lord Jesus was God's Son?
Right!
Looks like we're thinking along the same lines again.
Really?
The Lord Jesus also prayed many times to His Father in heaven.
Doesn't that prove Jehovah God and the Lord Jesus were Father and Son?
Yes! Exactly!
The Father was the Father, and the Son was the Son.
Two separate persons, right?
Add the Holy Spirit,
and doesn't that make a Trinity?
That's exactly what I asked Brother Zhang.
And then?
I was left speechless!
Right.
How did you know?
You are always left speechless.
Hey!
What did Brother Zhang say this time?
"Brother Li,
if you think Jehovah God and the Lord Jesus are Father and Son, two persons,
it hasn't been acknowledged by the Lord Jesus."
The Lord Jesus doesn't acknowledge it?
And two thousand years ago,
someone asked the Lord Jesus this very question.
Huh?
He said to the Lord,
You mean the Lord Jesus' disciple Philip.
That's right.
How did the Lord Jesus answer him?
You see,
Yes.
The Lord also said,
The Lord Jesus said very clearly
that He and the Father are one.
They are one God and one Spirit.
The Lord Jesus and Jehovah are one God,
so how could people say They are Father and Son?
The Father is God's Spirit,
and the Son is God's Spirit wearing flesh.
In human language, the metaphor we use is Father and Son.
When the Lord Jesus appeared and worked,
a voice from heaven proclaimed,
This was none other than the Holy Spirit testifying to His incarnate flesh.
But if that's the case,
why did the Lord Jesus call the Spirit in heaven His Father?
That's right!
We're thinking along the same lines again!
Oh!
What are you doing?
And Brother Zhang left you speechless again!
Wrong!
This time he was left speechless.
He read two paragraphs for me and I completely understood.
What? What did he read?
It's all there in our group's chat.
- Really? Let me see. - Have a look.
Hey!
These words make it so clear!
Yes!
The Lord Jesus was incarnate flesh,
and He called the Spirit in heaven His Father
from the perspective of created mankind.
That's right,
and that was Christ's humbleness and obedience.
No matter whether the Lord Jesus was praying to the Spirit from the perspective
of a created being or speaking and working as God,
His essence was always divine.
He was always the same God and Spirit as Jehovah.
He was not, as people imagine, Jehovah's Son.
God came to earth in incarnate flesh
just like the old saying:
"Old Man in the sky
came down to the mortal realm."
Now I understand.
No matter from what perspective God's incarnate flesh speaks and works,
He is still God Himself.
That's right.
And actually, in the Age of Law, God never became incarnate flesh,
but was Spirit,
so the idea of the Father and Son didn't exist.
The idea of the Father and Son
only existed after God became incarnate flesh.
Yes.
When God's work in His incarnate flesh concluded,
He returned to the spiritual realm,
and He remained as Spirit,
after which the idea of the Father and Son fell out of use.
The religious community
didn't understand the truth of God's incarnation,
so when they saw that the Lord Jesus prayed to the God in heaven as His Father,
they believed the relationship between Jehovah God and the Lord Jesus was that of Father and Son.
And when they saw that the Father sent the Holy Spirit to work,
their imagination ran wild
and they produced the fallacious theory of the Trinity.
So now,
don't you think it's ridiculous?
So that's how …
that's how the Trinity theory of God came about!
Yes!
People had no knowledge or understanding of God's incarnate flesh…
Right.
…so they divided God into three parts.
It was an incredible display of ignorance!
That's right.
Hey!
Brother Zhang also taught me a hymn.
I saw the lyrics in the group chat.
Should I sing it for you?
Go right ahead.
Music.
God really is all-powerful!
He's still God Himself.
Hey!
That's a very thorough explanation.
Right.
God's Spirit encompasses all things, and He is everywhere.
Yes.
And even though He rules over all things in heaven,
He can also come to earth to work and speak.
That's right.
Now, keep listening.
That's right.
God's works truly are miraculous!
Yes.
God's Spirit can appear to people in different ways.
While He rules over everything in heaven,
He can also come in incarnate flesh to work on earth,
redeem mankind, and save mankind,
and He can work in people to enlighten and illuminate them.
Yes.
No matter whether God appears as a Spirit
or as incarnate flesh to work,
it is always the same God at work.
God could never become two Gods or two Spirits.
Yes.
He is forever the one true God!
That's right!
God is so almighty and wise!
God will forever be unfathomable to man.
Yes.
No matter how rich people's imaginations,
or how well the theories fit with man's notions,
they are not the truth, nor reality.
There is only one God,
which is an eternally immutable fact that no one can deny.
Right.
The theory of the Trinity that the religious community clings to
is like someone standing on the edge of a blade:
It's not stable!
Now he really understands.
The theory of the Trinity
is based on people's notions and imagination, and is a fallacy.
The Trinity doesn't exist at all.
That's right.
To tell the truth…
Yes?
…each time I hear the pastor talk about the Trinity,
it feels like my brain is filling with sludge.
The more I hear, the more confused I get.
Right.
When you ask for clarification, the pastor just says,
"The Trinity is a profound mystery.
Man will never have the wisdom to understand it clearly.
All we can do is rely on our faith to believe it."
You hear that?
It's obviously an evil saying.
Even the pastor himself can't explain it clearly,
so he insists on calling it a mystery!
Like a bridge made out of matches:
It doesn't hold up!
That's true!
Those religious leaders, who thought they understood the Bible,
invented this evil fallacy of the Trinitarian theory based on their own imaginings.
They greatly confused people's understanding of God,
and deceived generation upon generation of believers.
They really harmed people!
And even worse,
this theory divides God and is blasphemy.
God's word states,
Hey!
And it's a very serious problem!
Right.
It looks like the leaders and theologians of the religious community
really don't understand the Bible.
Even though they can interpret the Bible,
they also have such a major misunderstanding of God,
and they don't actually know God.
Right.
Otherwise,
they wouldn't have come up with such a terrible fallacy as the Trinitarian theory
to deceive people.
That's right.
Delimiting God as a Trinity is an offense to God's disposition!
Oh, yes.
The Trinitarian theory has deceived the religious world for almost 2,000 years,
but now the truth has finally been revealed!
Yes!
The clouds are gone, we can see the blue sky!
Thanks be to the Lord!
Yes.
Huh?
What?
But I'm confused.
Why?
If no one could see through the evil fallacy
of the Trinitarian theory for 2,000 years,
how was Brother Zhang able to see through it?
The real question is,
who said all the things he reposted in the group?
Look at the source of the quotes.
The source?
From The Word Appears in the Flesh.
Huh?
The Word Appears in the Flesh
are the words personally expressed by Almighty God, Christ of the last days,
and are also the words spoken by the Holy Spirit to the churches as prophesied in Revelation.
So then, Brother Zhang has accepted Almighty God?
That's right.
Almighty God is the returned Lord Jesus.
Without God personally appearing to express the truth and reveal these mysteries,
who else could expose the ancient evil fallacy of the Trinitarian theory?
Hey!
What are we waiting for?
What?
We should go find Brother Zhang now!
For what?
To investigate Almighty God's work of the last days!
I'm not going.
Why?
I just got back from seeing him!
Oh! He already did!