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  • Hi everyone, it's Marie Forleo.

  • And you're watching Marie TV for a very special edition.

  • Because we've decided to do this interview here with my dear friend Chris Guillebeau.

  • And guess what,

  • he got an awesome new book out right now.

  • And it's call the Happiness of Pursuit.

  • And I'm so excited…I adore Chris, I adore his work.

  • Many of you know him already.

  • We did an interview for his last bookthe hundred dollars startup.

  • And he's just the one of the sweetest, kindest, smartes,

  • most brilliant people

  • And I wanna to have a month off maybe, because I thought these concepts were awesome,

  • so ChrisThank you for coming back on Marie TV.

  • Marie, hello and thank you.

  • It's a huge honor. I'm so happy to be back. Thank you!

  • Awesome. So tell us about the Happiness of Pursuit

  • Finding a quest that will bring perfect to your life

  • So what inspire you to write this new book?

  • Okay. So since we last talked,

  • I'm in wrapping up some personal project.

  • It's a request to visit every country in the world.

  • We talked about it a little bit last time.

  • I've been working on it for eight years or so.

  • Then, it's a ten years request in total.

  • I'm just kind of came to the end of it last year.

  • It was something that's… initially, it's just a personal project.

  • It was something that I believe in for myself.

  • And I love to travel and I love

  • valuable inspiration and discovery.

  • Soas I presume this request, I knew I wanted to write something about it.

  • But fortunately, I didn't just write a book about myself.

  • I didn't just write I travel where because that will be kind of boring,

  • soall along the way

  • I was meeting lots of interesting, remarkable people

  • who were all pursuing a quest or some kind of adventure of their own.

  • And, I wanna to know why did they do it.

  • And what's the lesson they learned along the way

  • and how are they changed for the process.

  • What did they sacrifice or give up in order to pursue it

  • And why about othersyou know what can the rest of us learn about quests.

  • And thenlastly, it's not really meant to be a sociological study.

  • It's not just like the collect of likethis person do this, and this person do thisblah blah

  • The book actually has a clear message. And the message is that a quest can improve your life.

  • A quest can actually bring purposes and meaning to your life.

  • I love it. So let me ask you this

  • Were you, as a young person or as a young boy,

  • were you always into an adventure? Did you have quest when you're little?

  • I don't know if I have quest. For say…I was always a list-maker.

  • This is something that I notice. This is actually really common. For all the people I talked to

  • I really like to write things down.

  • I like to write down my tasks, write down my ideas and outline even in rough form.

  • I really like to kind ofyou know break things down and just little project sort of thing

  • So I think it wasmaybe

  • a value that I haveand I'm kind of grew into it more

  • And then I start traveling and it wasn't like…I went to my first country

  • Oh I'm go toyou know, the rest of every single 193 countries in the world

  • I'm kind of gain confidence as I have some experience.

  • That was something else I saw… a lot of different people

  • They started with this small vision and they kind of came to bigger one later one.

  • Interesting. So if I heard you right,

  • and please correct me if I'm wrong

  • When you started to traveling to different countries, it wasn't necessarily like

  • Wellobviously, because you might have done some travel early on in your life

  • But as you got that appetite web for travel,

  • you saw an expanded visionhey

  • Why don't I set this adventure goal for myself to see every country in the world

  • So wasn't even like you started off likethis is my quest' something that evolved.

  • Yes. Absolutely, I have no idea.

  • That this would become something that will conceal my life for more than ten years

  • I just start traveling. I love traveling.

  • I live in west Africa for a while

  • and kind of gain some confidence

  • And just really enjoy the joy of being in different places

  • And I think it was after I've been to like fifty countries or so.

  • I was likeit's not difficult after like being to 50ish.

  • I have a thought that let me set a personal goal. Coz I always like goals.

  • I try to go to a hundred countries, right.

  • So that was the first one.

  • And then I start to getting close to that and I thought um

  • How can I take it up a level because I'm just going to half the countries in the world.

  • It's kind of cheat a little bit.

  • So you know… I could just pick the easy countries. So yea. That was something I were into, totally.

  • I reallyfor me, what made the differences was

  • combining travel with goal setting,

  • Combining travel with something specific,

  • with structure, with a little bit of container to it.

  • And that's just kind of change the whole purpose and focus for me.

  • And you saw that with the people and the book as well that they perhaps started something

  • Their appetite got web. And all of a sudden a new bigger world open up for them

  • That became this quest, this adventure they want to go on?

  • Yes. Very often. And the specificity hunts a lot

  • There is one storyRobin Devin and Omehan Annarasca

  • she's knitter.

  • And she's like super excited about knitting and she's artist, she make stuff and

  • She has this project to make hats for people.

  • and that's how it was at first. She's like I'm gonna make hats

  • so she makes hat for a friend or family just like the other knitters do.

  • But then, she had the idea of creating some specific structure to it.

  • And at first she thought…I wanna knit a thousand hats

  • likewonder what that look like you know So she's starting toward that

  • figuring how much time and how much money

  • and whether any other cost all that

  • And then, she decided to increase the goal and go to the ten thousands hats

  • So now, it's like her life quest to figure how many years it's gonna take.

  • You could actually go to her website and request a hat

  • maybe your wedding period

  • But eventually she's going to make ten thousand hats.

  • So yea, a lot of people, they found their vision expanded

  • but then also as they work for something. They may get it more specific.

  • So let's talk about the link between quest or adventure that we can go on, if you want to call it that

  • And happiness. What did you discover not only for yourself

  • but what did you discover from the story that everyone you interview in the book.

  • So for myself, you knowwhen I start to traveling and pursuing the goal

  • I think it kind of came out of the sense of discontent or dissatisfaction

  • which doesn't mean that I was miserable or I was terribly unhappy like I have a good life

  • You know…I have become an entrepreneur working for myself.

  • But yet, I guess I felt I wanted to challenge myself. I wanted more.

  • And a lot of people that we talked to or in the book,

  • they had the same kind of discontent.

  • It was yearning for something.

  • It was yearning to connect something broader in their life.

  • They often were happy, they have families,

  • they have good jobs or good businesses or something.

  • But yet, you knowthey had this desire to go further.

  • That where I saw really a link between the happiness and the pursuit of the goal.

  • The pursuit of a goalyou knowbigger than ourselves.

  • Something that is really significant. Something that is really challenging.

  • Because there's also a link between a request and a challenge I think.

  • If your quest is to go down the street and get coffee and come back.

  • That's not really a quest, right?

  • When you combine it with something challenging

  • maybe hard but also rewarding

  • You knowthat what I think a lot of us can find happiness.

  • Have you seen that people are working on multiple quests at once or

  • do most people kind of choose something that feels challenging, needy,

  • maybe a little bit scary, totally exciting?

  • Sure. I think there is more than one wayyou knowto do it.

  • and I'm always the kind of person that like to work on a bunch of stuff at once.

  • It's just my personality you know. For better or worse.

  • But I also thinkyou know… a true quest a true adventure

  • Does involve some kind of sacrifice.

  • You knowit does involve some kind of trade-off.

  • I mean that sacrifice is too heavy word so let's say trade-offyou know.

  • To go to every country in the world, it's like

  • it was a pretty big thing. There were a lot of things that I have to say no to in order to say yes to that.

  • Like what? Like what

  • like building my careeryou knowlike

  • I was on the road in central Africa and

  • central Asia and Bangladesh all these places a hundred days a year often

  • I couldn't really working my business very muchyou knowduring that time

  • But it was okay. I have to say no to lots of opportunitiesyou know that are coming through.

  • But I guess I really believe in thisprize.

  • I really believe in doing it and everytime I was start to think

  • Oh maybe I…you knowshouldn't get on that plane or go to Chad whatever.

  • No. I have to do it. Because this is the rule of everything.

  • This is the foundation of everything else.

  • So yes. I think you can do a lot of stuff.

  • But I guess it's alsoif you believe in something like

  • it's going to take something from you as well.

  • Yea. I love this discussion because

  • it's speciallycause I love that you share the self doubt

  • that can creep up I think

  • For anyone who's creative if youyou knowcall it a quest

  • or if it's a project you know. To write a book or something to build a business

  • To create something that's never been created before

  • And part of that adventure is that you're bringing it to the world.

  • I think that self doubt is so

  • it's a topic that many of uslikewe don't like to talk about

  • I love hearing that you were likeshould I get on this plane to Chad?

  • I have all these different opportunities coming in.

  • I mean…I'm working on another writing project right now. And I feel like

  • doubly the self doubt voices are like

  • God. Does anyone knowing about this? Do they even care?

  • It's amazing. Did you notice that the other folks that you interview as well

  • had those wrestling with self doubt

  • In pursuit their adventure or quest?

  • Absolutely. Like almost all of them.

  • Almost all of them in different ways. They spoke about it in different ways.

  • People uses different languagebut everyone is experiences that thing.

  • I think the bigger the challenge, the more the self-doubt and the more the fear.

  • But also maybe more the stern that you have to do it.

  • You know. It's this idea. It's not gonna leave you alone.

  • And I think a lot of them are maybe focus on a long-term. They are focus on outcome

  • and they thought about the book they wanna to write or whatever it was. And then,

  • imagine having that out and think about the people who will be helped by it.

  • That's kind ofyou got them throughyou know they focus on the other side.

  • I mean…I think a lot of them also.

  • The other interesting thing to say that they had in common

  • was a lot of them had what I call

  • The emotional awareness of mortality.

  • This also sounds kind of heavy,but it doesn't need to

  • I love it. We talk about death on marie TV all the time because I think

  • I just think it's one of the most sobering and it wakes you up

  • It wakes you up to value every moment so I'm not to interrupt. Let's talk about that.

  • Let's talk about that reality and mortality.

  • Right. So the emotional awareness of it is suppose to be intellectual awareness.

  • I think everyone has intellectual awareness and some mortality which I find in the book

  • That just the fact that everybody dies, right? It's a fact.

  • But the emotional awareness of mortalitywell I notice that

  • A lot of these people talk about it in the interview.

  • And they brought it uplike I don't even ask… “Hey! What do you think about death?” You know

  • It's not really a best interview question.

  • But a lot of them talked about different experiences they had

  • either with like an accident they have

  • Or close folk they had, or someone they love and lost

  • Something that just

  • brought them closer to the awareness that

  • not only everyone else in the world is gonna die one day, but I too.

  • You knowwe all die.

  • And just the focus on the fact that life is short we should live with urgency.

  • You knowthat also kind of helps overcome some of the stuff out. I think

  • Okay, what really matters?

  • Yea. I got my own stuff I got my own anxiety

  • or whatever that thing is that I'm most struggle with.

  • But I also have this dream and I also want more.

  • I want to improve my life. You know…I'm taking time to watch Marie TV because

  • Not just I wanna to entertain but I wanna improve my life. I wanna take stepstoward that.

  • So that's something else that people had in common. And I think it's actually helpful.

  • Yea. That's one of the values of this. That's one of the values of your book.

  • I'm so happy that you wrote it.

  • And that we're sharing it today. So many of us can find ourselves different part of journey.

  • Struggling withyou knowis there more? Is there more meaning?

  • I think one of the touching storis for me was about

  • the young man who lost his wife.

  • Can you tell a little bit about that story?

  • Yes. Ummthis is a beautiful story it's a sad story.

  • But it's also a beautiful story.

  • This is the story that a young couple who met in South Korea.

  • And he was American, she was Canadian.

  • And they were both teaching English there.

  • They met when they're really young say young 20s or so.

  • And they fell in love. And they were beginning to plan a life together.

  • But unfortunately, she received the diagnoses of the breast cancer.

  • So they return to America and she got treatment.

  • But unfortunately that it was not successful.

  • So she ended up going into the hospice

  • Andbefore she die,

  • she had been writing a blog and she had her own bucket list of all these things she wanna to do in her life

  • And she began you knowworking toward