It's backed by the new Statesman magazine on the publishers for Argo.

Now it coincides with the 20th anniversary of the Baileys Price for women's literature, formerly known as the Orange Price.

Well, I'm joined now by Helen Loosely deputy editor off the new Statesman.

One off the judges for the new award.

Of course, Sunder Down the line is we call it on best selling author Nadine Dorries.

And funny enough.

Her latest novel is today.

Let's Stay with Unity.

Know what Do you think that about the overall issue before we discuss the specifics of gender specific women's specific book awards?

Well, I think it's fantastic because, you know, women out sail men by 70 to 30 and traditionally over time, that has never Bean recognized.

It's never being acknowledged on you know, we have the Baileys Prize, which I think is celebrating their 20th anniversary this year.

If I'm not wrong, I think we need more of it.

But when I would buy, only concerned with the new statesman is this really?

And that's that women don't need another layer of prejudice because they experience it every day on the new Statesman does have a brand on.

It is a very left wing branch, and I just hope that when they judge and they critique and look att tthe e entries for their prizes that they leave her politics at the front door and judge every woman on her own marriage.

I know what her political beliefs are.

Well, we'll do that straight away.

Then Helen S.

So it's not going to have a left wing e.

I don't think it will do because it's about politics and economics.

And I think it's about the quality of the analysis, and it's possible to bring a very right wing analysis.

Don't measure those do it incredibly skillful in this.

Definitely.

There's always been a place for that in the New States when we've always seen ourselves as being kind of quite a pluralistic place for debate.

So, yes, it won't be a prejudice against right wing people, but they have to write as well as left wing people.

There are some questions being asked have Bean looking on social media about it, in particular from women, about it being sponsored by Bailey's Bailey's.

Using it is as a marketing attempt to target the drink specifically at women.

A Baileys for the lady.

I think if Bailey's want to give money to sponsor a fiction prize, I can't imagine they're doing that out of pure altruism.

I don't think the world is awash with with companies, do things that pure altruism.

But you have to say, Is that worth the trade off?

If they decide that they want to market to women?

I think that's perfectly legitimate thing to do.

They're going to stump up the money for it.

I don't really see the problem with that.

Okay, Nadine, do you feel oh on this issue of politics and economics that women just don't taken seriously?

And they're this, Of course, some relates directly to your experience in the House of comments.

No, no, I mean women are, I think, judged with a more opaque filter than men, both on their political opinion on their position on politics, whatever that might be on.

There is far more commuters had just on a moment ago.

There is far more vitriolic attack aimed at women who have an opinion who are strong on who right, and it doesn't matter whether they write about politics or economics or fiction.

You know, I've experienced that myself, you know, Even though my book was a best seller, my first book, it was slated by the male reviewers Andi Unfavorably reviewed by the women.

And I think that there has to be a recognition of the fact that women have a tough time, both in publishing an infection in all spheres of writing.

On the more prices that we have, women only prices, the better.

And if the men object, then bring on an all male prize.

That's fine.

But you know, we really have to acknowledge this.

Women have had a tough time, Helen, lose something.

You find yourself in a lot of agreement.

I know it's quite it's quite shocking to me that we finally have an issue that brings me in the dean together, but I think that there's a point some people will say that Shame it, shocking Helen that it's something that this prices is sexist and where is the men's price?

But the trouble is that a lot of prices end up being men's prizes by default.

This year, The Samuel Johnson Price, for example, not another nonfiction price has a long list of 12.

There's only one woman on that on the reason that the Orange Prize winners were women.

But what happens is when you look at these things in the round, you discover that men far down And as the Dean said, Actually, most most fiction is written by women.

Most fiction is bought by women, but yet for some reason we think that the best fiction must be by and about men.

But, I mean, let's mention other other prizes, of course.

The granddaddy of the Man Booker.

1/2 of the last 10 minutes of being Women okay, Hilary Mantel twice but got Elena cotton as well on and write and hear and decide.

You know, this is for everyone.

One of the eyes is really interesting to look at is the number of women who don't have Children on Dean's.

An interesting example of that she got her first book published after she heard Children were quite a lot older and actually one of the big things that's a problem for women is they can't go too literal festivals to promote their, but they can't come on TV to promote the book because I got caring responsibilities that men don't have.

And I think it's interesting to question when you look at the number of women who are winning prizes, actually, how many of them do have those Karen responsibilities?

Interesting point.

Care to comment on it?

It's absolutely true.

Also, the other thing, of course, Helen, is that you don't have time to write your books when you're a mother and you have carrying responsibilities on and that is an issue.

You know, I write my books very early in the morning, wants my Children have left home, and I think a lot of women are in the same position as I am.

They didn't have the time or the mental space actually to do what they've always wanted.

A many women don't actually have the confidence.

It takes the experience of a lifetime of mothering, of achieving both in your career on DDE, in parenting, to give you the confidence to be able to write.

Because I speak to so many women now who contact me, who wants to write but don't feel that they can put their book out there yet, and that's a great shame on my hope.

Actually, the more prizes we have in the more acknowledgment of women in publishing.

But that will change and hell loose.

I mean, is it what the books are about?

Or is it just the fact that they're written by women?

I made, I suppose in the case of this particular prize, it's not about women.

Writing for women is no, although there is a problem.

I think there is a kind of great men of history theory that a book about a general, for example, is deemed to have a kind of status that maybe about a female pioneer wouldn't.

I think If you look at something like last year's Oscar nominated films for the best picture, they will actually about men's lives.

And I think there's this kind of idea that if you write a book about a man's life, that's quite a big political statement.

If you write a book about a woman's life, it's sort of kind of.

It's a memoir, a biography.

It's it's somehow diminished by being associated with being feminine.

Nadine, I want to read you a quotation from It's a Block.

I read about someone who Dumb just got selected to stand as a member of Parliament.

They subsequently got in, and they went through a short list that had 12 men on it and five women on one through on the block.

Says this.

The crumbs question I want to ask myself is this.

If one of my three daughters became an MP as the results of being selected by on a woman short list, how proud would I feel?

I know the answer.

I would want them to compete on merits because they are worthy of that.

Now Who said that that was me?

Actually, that still holds true.

I think when you're applying to the electorate to be elected, you're not only being elected by women, you're being elected by all who make up 52% of the population.

You're being elected by everybody on, therefore, the process to put you in the position of standing before that electorate should be equitable, and you should be selected by an equal number of men as you are women.

But I don't think you can conflate standing for public office with the fact that 70% of women are the successful writers against 30% of men.

That is a different dynamic a statistic.

But can I just make this point on what we just on the previous discussion?

You know, I just like to say to Helen, but literary prizes very rarely go where the readers are on, whereas they're very valuable and very important, and I fully support applaud them there.

It seems to be this cousin of what readers by on what On almost elitist group of judges on those who critique that the work, full prizes.

Demers worthy a prize, and I think that's a chasm that has to be crossed so that the public can be involved and interested in these literary prizes as much as the publishing world is okay.