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  • Speaker 1: Good afternoon, everyone. Thank you all for coming out. Today, our program

  • is Music Therapy and Aging, and we're very lucky to have with us Chrissy Pearson from

  • the Baycrest Center. She has a Bachelor of Music Therapy, is a registered psychotherapist,

  • and a fellow of the Association of Music and Imagery. She received a Bachelors of Music

  • Therapy from the University of Windsor in 2002, interned at Sunnybrook Health Sciences

  • Centre in Aging and Veteran Care, and she has worked in various settings, including

  • long-term care, palliative care, acute care, adult group homes and schools. And in addition

  • to practising traditional music therapy, Chrissy is a fellow of the Association of Music and

  • Imagery, and practice guided imagery and music as well. And currently works at Baycrest as

  • well as in the Music Therapy Center, so it should be quite a fascinating program. And

  • here's Chrissy Pearson.

  • [applause]

  • CP: Thank you so much, Greg, and thanks for having me here. I don't know if you can see

  • me over this, I'm not very tall, but I am back here. And we're getting beep, beep, beep.

  • Here we go. I'll just use the keypad. So I'm here to talk to you today about music therapy,

  • and specifically music therapy and aging. Here's a little bit of an overview. So I'm

  • gonna tell you a little bit about myself and why I'm even interested in this field and

  • how I came to the field. I'll give you a short explanation about what exactly music therapy

  • is. I'm gonna talk about music therapy and dementia, as well as music therapy for caregivers,

  • and also music therapy for what I'll call "normal aging", I'm not sure there is such

  • a thing as normal aging. But focusing in those three areas. And we'll talk a little bit about

  • some case examples I'll share with you from clients that I've worked with to give you

  • some examples, and finally, we'll maybe talk a little bit, if we have time, about how you

  • can use music in your day-to-day life just to simply be more wild, no matter what stage

  • in the aging process you're in. So I'll tell you a little bit about my interest. I had

  • a very musical childhood, I... My mother forced me to start piano lessons when I was very

  • young and I hated playing the piano, and she insisted that this was a good skill for me

  • to learn.

  • CP: And when I entered the sixth grade in elementary school, I was fortunate to be in

  • a school that had a music program and I chose to play the flute and I loved playing the

  • flute, and I went home and begged my mother, "Please can I stop with piano lessons and

  • take flute lessons." And fortunately, they said yes, that that would be alright with

  • them, and I started playing the flute and practising the flute with an independent teacher,

  • and in school, and played in all the bands, and did all of those musical things that I

  • was able to do throughout high school.

  • CP: And at the same time, my grandparents were all aging, and two of my grandparents

  • developed different kinds of dementia. And without knowing anything about music therapy,

  • I, especially with my grandfather, would go to his long-term care home and play music

  • with him, and sometimes some of the other residents would come and we'd sing together.

  • It didn't occur to me at the time that that was something even interesting, it was just

  • something that I was doing. And as it got time for me to graduate high school, I was

  • thinking about, "What am I gonna do and what do I want to study?" I was interested in clinical

  • psychology and thought, "Okay, I'm gonna go to university and study psychology or maybe

  • I'll study social work."

  • CP: I wanted to work with people, and my mom, who was a guidance counsellor, came to me

  • and said, "Look at this really neat program, it's called Music Therapy." And it sort of

  • beautifully blended my love of music with my desire to help people, and that's sort

  • of what got me to that place. In terms of the other thing that really made this click

  • for me, was just my own sort of life philosophy that no matter who we are, no matter what

  • our challenges are, what our abilities are, if we're living independently or needing support,

  • that we all have a right to live in a way that I would call well. We deserve to live

  • well, we deserve to have the resources that can help us to live well, and I really believe

  • music therapy, as a profession, is something that can help people to achieve that. And

  • being well is defined differently depending on who we are, and as we go through today's

  • presentation, you may see yourself in the presentation or other people from your family

  • that you love and care for, and how you feel about wellness might be different than the

  • next person, so I encourage you to sort of keep your own values in mind and your own

  • philosophy around what it means to be well as we go through the process of aging. What's

  • the saying? It's not how long we live, it's how how well we live, and that's sort of the

  • philosophy that guides me.

  • CP: So we'll talk a bit about music therapy. What is it? To become a music therapist, some

  • people are always surprised when I say to them, "I have a Bachelor of Music Therapy."

  • There's a degree that you take to become a music therapist. The degree involves being

  • part of the music department, part of the psychology department, and part of the music

  • therapy department. So it's three areas that you study, lots of practicum experience because

  • we are trained to work with lots of different kinds of people. So not just people who are

  • aging or have challenges related to aging, we work with many different kinds of people,

  • and our education prepares us for that.

  • CP: After we graduate, we do a 1,000 hours supervised internship that is within an area

  • that really interests us, and followed by a certification process. So once we've received

  • the certification, we can confidently say that we're ready to practice music therapy.

  • In Canada, there's five schools only that offer the training program. If you're interested

  • in the training program, I can... You can e-mail me and I can send you lots of information

  • about that. So the Canadian Association for Music Therapy, that's our national governing

  • body. They're the ones who set out all the expectations for education.

  • CP: They set out our code of ethics, our standards of practice. They oversee all the certification,

  • they make sure that our membership is up-to-date and that we've been continuing our education

  • so that their members are professionally competent across the country and practising appropriately.

  • And areas and scope of practice, I'm not gonna talk a lot about this because I could talk

  • about it for hours. Essentially anyone who could use music... Sorry, rather anyone who

  • could use therapy could work with a music therapist.

  • CP: So whether it's a teenager in a youth program who's suffering with depression or

  • a person in long-term care who has dementia, a child in palliative care who's dying of

  • cancer, no matter who you are or what you're trying to cope with, probably a music therapist

  • could help you work toward some of the goals that you're trying to achieve. The goals could

  • be behavioural in nature, so, for example, trying to stop a difficult behaviour for someone

  • who's in the later stages of dementia. It could be social in nature, so for children

  • with autism, helping them to be able to integrate and interact with each other. It could be

  • psychosocial in nature, so people who have maybe had trauma in their lives and working

  • through those traumas and helping them to understand them and work through them in an

  • easier way.

  • CP: The goals could be about communication, so very physical goals of regaining speech

  • and the ability to speak. It could be self-expression. There are sometimes musical goals as well,

  • sometimes we work with people who are coming to us to actually work on something that is

  • musical in their life. But generally, it's not really about the music at all, it's about

  • what we're trying to achieve with the music. And that's something that some people struggle

  • with, they think they have to be musical to benefit from music therapy and it's actually

  • the opposite.

  • CP: I find the people who are, let's say, less professionally musical are often more

  • open to participating in music therapy. So, no experience required to benefit. So, what

  • does music therapy look like? Again, it looks different depending on who you're working

  • with. Obviously, working with a street youth looks completely different than working with

  • someone who's dying in palliative care, and what we are trying to do is to use music and

  • to use musical elements in a way that meets the person's needs. So today we're gonna be

  • focusing on aging, we're gonna talk a bit about dementia, we're gonna talk about music

  • and the brain. What I'd like you to take away from this as well is that music therapy really

  • spans all ages, all abilities, all different challenges that you might face in life.

  • CP: And if you want more information about music therapy with different kinds of people,

  • that's something... I do have a handout if you want more information that you can take

  • with you before you go, and certainly, you can look some things up or contact me and

  • I'd be happy to tell you more about the different kinds of people we work with and what that

  • would look like.

  • CP: Okay. Oh, the one thing I forgot to mention: When we're talking about what music therapy

  • looks like, I often have people who are musicians or entertainers who say, "Oh, yes, I do music

  • therapy," and so, I always like to explain the difference between music entertainment

  • and music therapy. Entertainment, I'm gonna say, most of the time is very therapeutic,

  • and the therapeutic value in going to a concert or the therapeutic value in having someone

  • sing for you or being part of a choir, all of those things are very therapeutic. What

  • makes music therapy different is just the therapist, that you're working with someone

  • toward specific goals, you're working with them continuously to help progress through

  • some goals or to help achieve a sort of level of wellness that you're not able to achieve

  • without it, and that, that sort of defines the entertainer from the therapist. But I

  • always tell the entertainers, "You're not wrong, you're just not a therapist."

  • CP: So yes, what you're doing is absolutely valuable and probably therapeutic for many

  • of the people who are coming to listen to your music and to interact with your music,

  • maybe dance and move to your music. That can be a beautiful, therapeutic thing, and music

  • therapy is what we're gonna talk about today, which takes it to a different level.

  • CP: So music in the brain is something that is being talked about in the media all the

  • time right now. I'm very, very sure that most of you have, have heard about some of the

  • interesting stories. What comes to mind right now is Gabby Giffords in the US when she was

  • shot, part of her recovery was working with a music therapist to regain her ability to

  • speak. Stories like that are everywhere right now and getting lots of attention, which is

  • really exciting for music therapists because it's been a long time of trying to educate

  • people about how this all works.

  • CP: And as we age, no matter what challenges we face, our brains are gonna change. That's

  • just what happens are... From the time that our brains are developing to the time that

  • we leave this earth, our brains are constantly changing, and as we age, the changing starts

  • to happen faster and in different ways.

  • CP: And sometimes that involves additional challenges, whether it's a memory loss or

  • physical ability that we lose. All of those things are going to happen no matter how deep

  • the challenge. We're probably gonna encounter something. And now that we have all of this

  • research that talks about the brain, we really understand why music therapy is so effective

  • and we can thank MRI machines and all the other scanning machines out there that look

  • at what's happening when we... Not only when we listen to music, but when we participate

  • in music and when we're working with a music therapist.

  • CP: So it's neat, they can see the difference between putting a CD on and listening to the

  • music versus singing along to the music or moving our bodies to the music versus sitting

  • with a music therapist and working through something musically. The scans all look different,

  • but what does look the same is that music is everywhere in our brain. It used to be

  • that people thought... Not people, researchers, scientists thought that music had a place

  • in our brain, much like speech has a place, much like movement or memories or emotions.

  • A lot of things have specific areas of the brain and if that area gets damaged, then

  • that skill gets damaged or that ability is damaged. What makes music so effective is

  • that it is literally everywhere in our brain.

  • CP: So when we're listening to music, lots of different areas light up. When we're participating

  • in music, even more areas of the brain light up. And that's why, especially as we age and

  • have challenges with memory or have challenges with speech or have challenges with movement

  • or physical abilities, music can often be helpful. There's four areas up there that

  • I've connected to the brain. You can see rewiring, I'll talk a little bit about that because

  • I find it to be really fascinating, memories, cognition and movement, and pleasure's there

  • at the bottom.

  • CP: Pleasure is a really important one. If we're not enjoying the music that we're listening

  • to, different areas of the brain light up that say, "Yeah, that's... I don't really

  • relate to that." So one thing to remember is that enjoying the music that you're...

  • Whether you're listening to it or working with a music therapist, you have to have that

  • pleasure principle for it to be really effective.

  • CP: Okay, so let me let me look at a few of these areas of the brain. Now that we know

  • sort of how effective it is, I really think it's... It's kind of the simplest and most

  • complex thing that we could talk about, is how music impacts the brain. When one part

  • of the brain is damaged, so for example, we have a stroke or we get dementia, we start

  • to lose our long-term memories, our short-term memories, music has the ability to sort of

  • rewire the brain.

  • CP: So if I've had a stroke and I can no longer speak, but I'm looking at you and I want to

  • say something, I cognitively know what I want to say but I don't have the ability to actually

  • say the words, we can often sing before we can speak. And I've worked with many people

  • through different music therapy techniques, singing always comes first, and it's really

  • fascinating to see that progression. And now we know what's happening is that the pathway

  • that's not working anymore, the pathway that's cut off or blocked or damaged is not needed

  • because music can help create a new pathway. So once the singing develops and making musical

  • sounds develops, that can transfer into speaking the sounds, and that's kind of the simplest

  • way to explain it. We could go through lots of scientific papers about how that works,

  • I'll just tell you from experience, it's fascinating to see and it really does work. The same is

  • true when we look at memory and things like dementia or other brain injuries that maybe

  • affect our memory. The last thing that we lose in terms of memories are musical memories.

  • Music sticks around, probably now we know because it's involved in so many different

  • parts of the brain.

  • CP: So often someone who's in the late stages of dementia can no longer recognize their

  • spouse's face or can no longer get up and feed themselves, when I go to see them and

  • if I know that they are you know, a really big Frank Sinatra fan, if I can pick a song

  • or run through a series of songs, chances are, something will catch their attention

  • and things in the brain start to line up and go, "That's familiar," and maybe they open

  • their eyes and they look at me, or maybe they look around the room and smile at people.

  • Maybe they even start singing. So we know now the reason that this is happening is that

  • the brain is experiencing the music in many, many more ways than it experiences one scale

  • or one... One thing that we're trying to do.

  • CP: Okay, to make sure we stay on time here so that I get through all of this, I love

  • talking about it so I can take up too much time. We're going to start by looking at music

  • therapy and dementia, and then we'll talk about caregivers and people who are not experiencing

  • challenges and how music therapy works and how it can be helpful. So when we're working

  • with a music therapist, we are doing consistent work. We're working on goals that are tailored

  • to the individual or tailored to a group. The therapist is going to develop a treatment

  • plan and make goals that they can track.

  • CP: So it really is something that we want to... As therapists, we want to see that what

  • we're doing is working. We can only do that if we have a plan and if we're writing our

  • observations and tracking things, trying different things to see if something might work better.

  • All of that is really important. That's also what kind of sets us differently from entertainment,

  • we really are looking for results and how we can better achieve those results.

  • CP: So I wrote down a couple of examples of some goals that I might work on with someone

  • who has dementia, keeping in mind that it's tailored to the individual. So if depression

  • isn't an issue, then that's not a goal, to help them with that, but for a lot of the

  • people I've encountered, depression and anxiety are often really prevalent when you're experiencing

  • those kinds of challenges. Self-expression and communication can be a challenge, that's

  • something we might work on.

  • CP: Helping someone to have meaningful interaction, again when we lose the ability to connect

  • with people, music can often help to facilitate that. Reminiscence and also maintaining memory,

  • so as things start to deteriorate, sometimes through music therapy we can extend that ability

  • to remember, whether it's a short amount of time or a longer amount of time. Any amount

  • of time is good if you're starting to lose those skills.

  • CP: And also decreasing difficult behaviour. A lot of the time as we're aging and if our

  • minds are not functioning the way they once were, and we get confused or we get agitated

  • or we don't know where we're going, we can have behaviours that are really difficult,

  • whether it's constantly wandering or becoming aggressive or behaving inappropriately with

  • other people. Music therapists often work to help decrease those behaviours and to help

  • the staff or the caregivers to understand how they could use music to help decrease

  • those behaviours.

  • CP: So those are some examples of what a music therapist might look at. At any stage through

  • the process of living with dementia, we can also help to facilitate whatever musical identity

  • that person had. So the reason I mention that is if you were a concert pianist, that identity

  • is probably really important to you, and so, a music therapist can sometimes work also

  • to really help maintain and to preserve the person's musical identity, which may be more

  • important for those who perhaps made a career out of music than someone who is a casual

  • concert-goer. But it is an important part of our identity sometimes and music therapists

  • can certainly help with that.

  • CP: So these goals will change depending on the stage of dementia, depending on what the

  • challenges are, but again, the important thing is that it's specific to the person or the

  • group of people, and usually, when I'm talking about a group, let's say we're talking about

  • a long-term care home, the nurses, the doctors, the other care staff will say, "You know what?

  • We have a bunch of men in this unit that are really not coming out and participating, they're

  • experiencing a lot of depression. They really don't want to get up and even go to their

  • meals, let's start a group for them." So they have common needs that the music therapist

  • will focus on and help them with those challenges. So group goals are really important, but it's

  • not just a group of people with various needs, we really wanna focus in and help people that

  • have similar needs.

  • CP: Okay, so these are the various places you might find a music therapist working,

  • if we're talking about working with people who have to dementia. That's a client of mine

  • that, during a group... This is a group of of men who had sort of early to mid-stages

  • of dementia and a big part of the group was to encourage any kind of spontaneous reaction

  • to active music-making. So I was always providing live music, it was very personalized to the

  • people that were in the group.

  • CP: And this particular group member, without fail, when a certain song was played, wanted

  • to get up and to move, and the other group members encouraged him and it was sort of

  • a big part of the... I guess the culture of the group that we had. It was a very successful

  • group, about seven men who supported each other, I would say right up until each of

  • them became too impaired to come to the group anymore. So this is a very special experience.

  • You'll also find music therapists working with people in a hospital setting, so often

  • there are places, at Baycrest, for example, complex continuing care in the hospital where

  • people live a long amount of time and music therapy can help them with the challenges

  • that come from living in a hospital setting.

  • CP: Also in palliative care, which palliative care of course spans through the ages, but

  • there are different challenges. I think when we reach palliative care, if we have aged

  • without any challenges versus are dying with dementia or dying with a disease that makes

  • our brains not cooperative and can be a very confusing time and a music therapist is often

  • a great addition at that time to help them to feel more secure and to feel less afraid

  • at that time, toward the end of their life.

  • CP: Day programs also, so music therapists will often provide services in a day programs.

  • Obviously, in a day program there's a lot of participants, so sometimes it's sort of

  • a community group that happens and other times the staff at the day programs have targeted

  • certain people to go off and have a group together. Okay, this is a photo of one of

  • our music therapists at Baycrest working with a gentleman in another music therapy group.

  • I'm going to take some time and actually, Greg, how much time do I have left? I didn't

  • bring my watch up here. I want to know how many stories I can tell you.

  • [background conversation]

  • CP: Okay, perfect. Thank you so much. I will give you a few stories to sort of illustrate

  • how I've worked with different people and what music therapy looks like at the different

  • stages of living with dementia. These are just some examples, but hopefully they give

  • you a little illustration of what this can be like. First I'll talk about Susan. I worked

  • with Susan at the Music Therapy Center, so that's my... The second hat I wear, I'm here

  • representing Baycrest, but I also do work at the Music Therapy Center.

  • CP: Susan had the early stages of Alzheimer's and she actually found us on her own and learned

  • a little bit about music therapy and thought it might be useful for her. So she called

  • and referred herself for music therapy and started coming to see me for one-on-one individual

  • sessions. She was really aware of her diagnosis obviously and not coping well with the fact

  • that this was going to be what the rest of her life looked like. She was very cognitively

  • able to understand how the disease would progress and what that would mean for her, she had

  • a lot of anxiety about not knowing how fast it would progress or what her family would

  • do without her, what kind of care she wanted as the disease progressed.

  • CP: So on the one hand, she had the opportunity to have a say in what her wishes would be

  • as the disease progressed. On the other hand, she lived a very long time in the early stages

  • and had a lot of anxiety and worry about what kind of burden would ensue as it progressed.

  • So we worked through a lot of grieving, she was grieving the life she had and also grieving

  • what she knew would be losses that were coming. We... I should say her husband brought her

  • for these sessions and while she was in the session with me, he would go and let her have

  • that time.

  • CP: It was really important for her to work through some of these things, knowing that

  • she could share things that she felt would burden her husband to share with him. So it

  • was very much a private session and very confidential as well. So we worked through a lot of things.

  • We always had some form of expression, so she sort of listed out music that was important

  • to her and we would always sing. Susan couldn't sing at all, and it took a while for her to

  • be comfortable using her voice. I kept saying to her, "We're not at Carnegie Hall, it's

  • just you and me." And eventually, she felt more comfortable with that.

  • CP: And the physical effects of singing are extremely beneficial if you're going through

  • something like anxiety or something where you kind of feel the weight of the world on

  • your shoulders, listening to music is great, singing music and making music has an even

  • greater effect physically on how you're feeling. So we got to that point where she was really

  • able to open up and express herself musically, we wrote songs together. Now she was not...

  • She had no formal music training, so obviously I facilitated the songwriting, but she ended

  • up writing five or six songs, two of them that she kept private, that I kept and did

  • not share with anyone after she wasn't able to come anymore. They're locked away in her

  • file privately and they were really about the struggle and about all of the difficulties

  • she was facing, but not things that she wanted to share with people.

  • CP: The other four songs were written for the different people in her family that she

  • wanted to leave a legacy for. She asked that I... After we recorded them and she did participate

  • in the making of the music. In one of the songs, she played a tambourine, in another

  • song, she did sing parts of it. We wrote the music together. So I would play, "What do

  • you want it to sound like?" and play something and she'd say, "No, no, no, that's too fast.

  • It needs to sound like this."

  • CP: So we worked through some songwriting together and produced a CD together that she

  • made the cover for with some meaningful pictures, wrote some messages inside the CDs. We put

  • them in a box, gave them to her husband, and the instructions were, "Once I'm not able

  • to remember anymore, once I don't know my children anymore, can you please give everybody

  • these CDs?" And the last thing that we did is she worked on creating play-lists for herself,

  • so a few years ago, the Alzheimer's Society started their Music and Memories program,

  • and we started hearing about personalized music and personalized play-lists. She found

  • that really fascinating, and so together we made, I'm gonna say, eight different play-lists

  • that, through music therapy research, I helped her to place songs in different orders and

  • with different tempos for different times of the day. So a play-list to help her to

  • wake up and become energized in the morning, a play-list to help her sleep at night, a

  • play-list for exercise, a play-list for relaxing. So we worked through that together as well.

  • So, that was Susan. Someone with sort of the mid-stages of dementia that I worked with

  • in long-term care, his name was Albert. He was no longer able to recognize his family.

  • He was usually quite happy, usually telling the same jokes and the same stories over,

  • and over, and over again. He wandered pretty constantly and was a really restless guy.

  • CP: So he was referred to me, number one, to give him an outlet for telling those stories

  • and hopefully to allow him to go beyond that constant repetitive storytelling and express

  • himself in different ways. So he... And it was a group that he was referred to and the

  • group was for people who were wanderers. People that couldn't sit down, couldn't stay still.

  • Magically enough, when you're focused on music, it's a lot easier to focus and to sit still.

  • So most of the patients that were part of that group were really able to focus. We worked

  • up from sitting for 20 minutes, and then the next week we'd try for 30, and the next week

  • we'd try for 45, and eventually, when it became a routine that felt familiar and felt good,

  • we were able to have one-hour sessions together.

  • CP: So that was a big goal for Albert, was to sit and to focus on something for an hour.

  • We really facilitated a lot of connection and interaction, so we used a lot of hand-held

  • instruments, and part of the goals that we had for the people in the group were to share

  • instruments. So after some directives, "Let's all play this with the drums. Now pass the

  • drum to your neighbour," those sort of interactive things that don't come naturally once our

  • minds start to become confused.

  • CP: We also really were trying to decrease his repetitive jokes, and then, initially,

  • he told the same joke throughout the entire group, and some of the other group members,

  • who were aware of the fact that they'd heard it five times, would get really frustrated

  • with him. But the more he came to the group, it was a weekly group, the more familiar he

  • became with the routine. Even though he didn't remember what he did last week, that routine

  • becomes familiar because it's consistent.

  • CP: And by the end of the time that we worked together, he would maybe come in and share

  • a joke at the beginning and then he was able to focus on what we were doing that day. Maybe

  • as he left, he would say, "I got another joke for you." But two jokes as opposed to 50 was

  • a really good accomplishment. What else here? Oh, the other goal that we had was for him

  • to have moments of accurate memory, and that one was really remarkable for Albert. There

  • was one group session we were all drumming, and for whatever reason, we talked about the

  • brain things lining up sometimes. Whatever it was with the rhythms we were keeping and

  • how we were drumming together, his son came through the doorway, and he turned and he

  • said, "David, come on in, pick up a drum." So in that moment, for whatever reason, things

  • were... If we had an MRI machine at the time, maybe we could have understood it more.

  • CP: All I know is that whatever was happening musically was working for him in that moment.

  • Things in the memory centers of his brain went, "Dut-dut-dut-dut-dut," and he looked

  • up and said, "I know that person." Now, there was no understanding around the fact that

  • usually he doesn't recognize that person, but in that moment, for the 10 seconds that

  • it took for his son to come and sit and to play the music with him, everything made sense.

  • And those kinds of moments aren't usually goals that we have because we can't expect

  • those things to happen, but when they do happen, it can be something really special for the

  • people that are there to witness it and there to feel it. And for that person, we really

  • hope that's a moment where things make sense, where things feel not confusing, where things

  • are meaningful to us. So that about five minutes at the end of the music therapy session, where

  • he and his son were really connected, that was an incredible five minutes for both of

  • them. As they left, the son kept singing with him and he reported to me that after their

  • one hour visit, he was still saying his son's name and still sharing about the music that

  • they were singing. So again, as the music kept going, we were able to have that successful

  • connection, which was a big gift for both of them.

  • CP: And lastly I'll talk to you about Barry; Barry had late-stage dementia, he lived on

  • a different unit in the long-term care home, this is at Baycrest. He's in a wheelchair,

  • he was completely dependent so not eating on his own, not able to grasp things or manipulate

  • things. So people were caring for him in terms of all the activities of daily living, he

  • usually had his eyes closed. Usually during care, so being showered or changed, he would

  • get really aggressive; which makes sense.

  • CP: If someone were to come and try to give you a bath and you didn't understand why they

  • were doing it, you would probably act aggressively. So he was referred for a few reasons, they

  • would have me come in the morning before they were getting him out of bed, so that I could

  • perhaps get him into a place where they could get him out of bed without that aggression

  • coming up. I also had sessions with him when his wife was there to try and facilitate some

  • connection between the two of them because otherwise she was really frustrated that he

  • didn't open his eyes, he never looked at her, she wasn't getting any responses from him.

  • CP: So we did those one-on-one sessions in the morning before care, and we did the sessions

  • with his wife once a week. We were trying to increase his alertness, so, "Can we help

  • him to open his eyes? Can we help him to connect on an alert level?" We were trying to increase

  • the interaction with his wife, and not just interaction, but meaningful interaction where

  • she could feel that he was there with her. Also trying to get some moments where he would

  • use his voice, whether that was just a sound or whether it was singing, that was something

  • that we were hoping for.

  • CP: It was one of those goals where we weren't looking for it every week, but when it did

  • happen, it was lovely. We also were trying to provide him with some sensory stimulation,

  • so if you've ever been in a long-term care home, you know that a lot of the time people

  • with late-stage dementia or people who require continuous care are often found sitting in

  • their wheelchairs in the hallway or sitting in front of a TV and not really aware of what's

  • going on around them, and this was really a way for us to provide him with stimulation

  • that he wasn't getting at other times of the day. So the musical stimulation, I would play

  • instruments and use his hands like a... If you know what a Cabasa is, it has a nice texture

  • to it, so using tactile things to stimulate him, to use my voice. And all of those things

  • together resulted in a few things.

  • CP: Number one, it was usually easier for the nurses to get him up in the morning and

  • to get him changed. So even though he wasn't opening his eyes and participating with me,

  • hearing the music is active participation. The brain is doing something, we don't know

  • what, but we hope that it's having a pleasant experience and we hope that it's providing

  • a sense of calm or a sense of feeling familiar. So I would come in, I knew which kind of music

  • he liked, which is a huge bonus. If I don't know what somebody likes, I usually improvise

  • music because the worst thing you can do is play something someone doesn't like and then

  • you're getting the opposite effect. But for him I did know what music he liked, so I would

  • spend about 10 minutes with him just playing music. In between the songs, I would improvise

  • and sing "It's time to get up, it's time to get up," and kind of cuing musically that

  • it was the morning, and that the staff were coming to get him soon. The staff would come

  • and they would sing with me and we would try to keep the music going while they started

  • to move his bed and get him sitting up and remove his clothing and do the things that

  • they needed to do to start his day.

  • CP: So after, I'm gonna say five or six sessions together, number one, the nurses kind of got

  • it more and were a little more receptive to participating in it, and then I'm gonna say

  • maybe two or three sessions later, we had our first really successful time where he

  • did not once lash out, he didn't call out. He wasn't opening his eyes or participating,

  • but he was very calm and very cooperative. So that was a big success, and the other thing

  • we were working on with his wife and interaction and some kind of level of alertness and level

  • of expressing, that was really, week-by-week, variable, and like I said with the last example,

  • when things did line up and really sort of visibly happened, those were gifts.

  • CP: On the times when that didn't happen, it was important for her to remember that

  • the music was still stimulating his brain. The music was still being registered no matter

  • what we were seeing from him. We can, through science now, understand that that was still

  • something that was happening for him. When we did have success, I would play a song that

  • he was familiar with, usually guitar and voice was what I would use, and sometimes if we

  • were having a day where it was really connecting, he would start to move his head a little bit

  • to the music.

  • CP: And after the song, I would say to him, "Barry, you're hearing that music," and he

  • would sometimes say, "Mmm," and the wife would say, "Ah! There he is." We would continue

  • and sing another song, and she would take his hands and start to move with him, and

  • sometimes he would squeeze back. So those little things were what we were trying to

  • achieve, sometimes our sessions were about half an hour because it was apparent that

  • he just wanted to sleep, other times when he would sort of have those signals that he

  • was more and more alert, we would keep going, and after an hour, sometimes he was vocalizing.

  • Never with words, but sometimes the melody. So if we were singing a song like 'You Are

  • My Sunshine', we wouldn't hear him sing the words but we would hear him, "Mmmm." Those

  • were moments where the wife would get out her tissues and sing along with him and say,

  • "There is my husband, that's him. I can hear him." So those are some examples of the work

  • that we do with people who are living with dementia. I wanna quickly talk about you heard

  • me talk about Susan and making personalized play-lists, this this really got big in the

  • media, especially in Toronto with the Alzheimer's Society Toronto and the project where they

  • were giving out iPods to families who had a person living with dementia.

  • CP: And at Baycrest, what I was finding was that families were accessing the service,

  • but they didn't really know what to do with it. The Alzheimer's Society does a great job

  • at providing the instructions for how to how to make the play-list, how to put it on the

  • iPod, how to use the iPod and charge the iPod and care for it, but they really weren't giving

  • any information around, "How do you make a good play-list? One that's gonna be really

  • effective for that person? When should you play it? How should you play it? How do you

  • do it in a way that's gonna really benefit them? And then what do you do if you are there

  • and something really emotional happens, if the person starts to weep or if the person

  • becomes aggressive. How do you respond to that?"

  • CP: So this... The picture that is up here is the picture of a booklet that we developed.

  • It's really aimed at... Well, it's really for everyone. We have some seniors at Baycrest

  • who use it for themselves, people who don't have cognitive impairment, family members

  • can find it very useful, some of the nurses who help facilitate listening to the music

  • find it really useful.

  • CP: So it's really meant for anyone that's interested in using music in that way, and

  • our hope is that some of the things that I was seeing were people left in the hallway

  • with headphones on and they're kind of slouched over and I'm thinking, "Okay, who put that

  • on them? How long have they been sitting here? Are they even processing this music?" It's

  • not an effective way to use a tool like this, so we're hoping that this document will help

  • people to better understand how they can use it in a way that's really effective. The problem

  • with what I just... The example I gave of someone sitting by themselves with the headphones,

  • that can be a barrier, that can be a boundary where the person doesn't hear what's going

  • on around them. If their eyes are closed and they're listening to the music, we don't really

  • know how they're processing it or or what they're experiencing. So this gives some tools

  • for how you can do that better, how it can be more effective, and really how it can be

  • a more safe experience. Music... If we're saying that music is very powerful, which

  • we know it is, then we also have to acknowledge that it can do damage as well. It can can

  • be something that, if we're not aware of it, could be doing something negative to the person.

  • So we really wanna be aware of those signals and be able to respond to them to make sure

  • that we're giving the person what they need in that moment.

  • CP: The other thing I wrote up here, real expectations. I had a grandson call me at

  • Baycrest and he said, "I've got the iPad... " Or iPod, "I've got the iPod, I've got the

  • play-list, music. I know my grandmother loves this music, I'm putting the headphones on

  • her, she's not waking up." And I thought, "Oh goodness. You poor thing, you're trying

  • so hard." And he had seen the YouTube clip of Henry, have you seen that? With the gentleman

  • in long-term care, and he's sitting in his wheelchair and he's kind of slumped over,

  • and the recreation person comes in and puts headphones on him and plays a song that they

  • know that he enjoys, and he sits up and his eyes open and he sings along to the music.

  • CP: And this was a really powerful clip, the movie itself is really powerful, but some

  • people got some unrealistic expectations that this magical thing was going to happen. If

  • they got the right music and they put the music on their loved one, that their loved

  • one is gonna sing and they're gonna come alive. So this document also is hopefully gonna help

  • people understand that even if your grandmother is not coming alive, if you know that that's

  • music that she loves, something in there is benefiting then, and on some level she's processing

  • that music.

  • CP: And there are some instructions in the guidelines as well for different things you

  • can try because on one day there may be nothing, on other days you try it differently and something

  • amazing might happen. So hopefully this will be a good resource. I do have a couple copies

  • of it, if anyone would really like one. I do have a couple. I think... Here at the bottom

  • there is a website, and I'm going to, if you'd like... If anyone is wanting to write this

  • down, I'm gonna tell you right upfront, it is really hard to find this on the Baycrest

  • website. It is hidden under every single tab that you could could ever come across.

  • CP: So maybe I won't say it right now, but if you're interested in finding this online,

  • come and talk to me afterwards and I'll tell you exactly where you can find it on the website,

  • or my e-mail's at the end of the presentation. You can take down my e-mail and I'd be happy

  • to send you a copy of it. It is on the website, but [chuckle] it's extremely difficult to

  • find it. Okay, so we're gonna talk about caregivers because when you're looking after someone

  • who has a cognitive impairment or a physical impairment or any kind of challenge, it's

  • often the caregivers that don't get support, and often they're the ones who need it the

  • most.

  • CP: In order to take care of others, you have to take care of yourself, that's something

  • that I've said to many of my family members. "You're doing a great job, but what kind of

  • care are you getting?" Music therapy might help caregivers to explore challenges and

  • emotions that are related to caring for someone. I've worked with some support groups, support

  • groups are a wonderful way for people to share what's happening and what they're going through,

  • to share ideas, to share advice with each other, but also to really work through that

  • it's difficult. And music therapy can be a means to work through those things, whether

  • it's in a group setting with other people in similar situations, or it might be something

  • you really wanna work on one-on-one and have that private therapeutic time. Music therapy

  • can help to achieve some balance, decrease burnout, burnout is a really difficult thing

  • for people who are caring for others. It can just be a way to promote wellness, and I'm

  • talking about physical wellness, feeling good in the morning, but also emotional wellness.

  • So even though your body might be going strong and you feel like, "Yeah, I can go and make

  • breakfast and get him dressed and get him out the door to the day program. Then I'm

  • gonna do this, this, this, and go pick him up again, and we're gonna come home. I'm gonna

  • turn on the monitors so that he doesn't get up and wander off the property."

  • CP: All of that stuff over and over and over again, you are going to experience burnout

  • if you're not taking care of yourself, and you are gonna be emotionally very, very taxed,

  • and music therapy can be sort of an accessible way to to go through some of that stuff. And

  • the last one I listed here is to increase connection with a loved one. So we have had

  • clients at the Music Therapy Center that come with their loved one, so someone who has an

  • impairment with their spouse, and it's a way for them to do therapeutic things together

  • and to leave feeling more connected and to leave feeling a little less stressed out,

  • a little more physically able, a little more emotionally ready for the rest of the day.

  • CP: So I really... If you are caring for someone in your life, I'd encourage you, if you're

  • looking for support, to consider something like music therapy as something that might

  • be really helpful for you. So "normal" aging, normal in quotation marks, there really is

  • no normal aging, but the people that I've lived with who have been fortunate enough

  • to age without having any kind of official diagnosis of some sort, still have challenges.

  • My dad is nearing 70 and he constantly says to me, "Aging is not for sissies. You have

  • to be tough to age," and I think, "Yeah, based on what I see in the work that I do, you're

  • right." No matter what you're going through, aging can be really difficult.

  • CP: There are challenges at every stage of life, aging is no different, and even those

  • who are healthy are gonna need some support in their life if they choose to seek it out.

  • If they choose to increase their wellness and increase their positive experiences, we

  • can preserve what's working well. So now we're learning more and more that, leading up to

  • older ages, there are things that we can do to help preserve what we have, to sort of

  • guard against things that might come up. Music therapy is a tool that can help with that

  • as well, especially when we're thinking about things like memory or cognition. There's lots

  • of research now that says learning an instrument or participating in a choir, those things

  • that exercise the musical brains that we have, maybe that can help to slow down a disease

  • progression. Maybe that can even stop the progression of the disease. We don't know

  • that exactly yet, but that's what we're hoping to find out as we do more and more research,

  • but certainly we know that it can be something to increase your wellness and hopefully preserve

  • what's working well for you and prevent future challenges.

  • CP: I know there's a choir that I lead at Baycrest in the day program, some of the people

  • there have mild cognitive impairment, some of them have physical needs that make it hard

  • to get through daily life, and the day program's a place they come together to do things that

  • make them feel well and also to give their spouse some respite to go and do all the errands

  • that need to get... It's not really giving the spouse a break, I don't like it when people

  • say that. They're not getting a break, they're going off and doing a million things before

  • they come back to pick up their loved one and get on with their day.

  • CP: But certainly the choir that we do, one of the goals is to be well, to sing together,

  • to make music together, hopefully to preserve some of the memories, hopefully to allow them

  • to take a deeper breath if they're having trouble with breathing, or to move their arms

  • and to move their bodies if their body is giving them difficulty with physical movement.

  • So participating in music therapy, hopefully we can help, that there won't be future challenges

  • with your cognition. Or maybe it will help you preserve memories longer than you would

  • have if you didn't seek something like this kind of intervention. Okay, what am I forgetting?

  • CP: Here we go. What can you do all by yourself without seeking the music therapy or working

  • with a therapist of any kind? Music is pretty accessible for us, especially now. Greg and

  • I were talking about technology and the challenges it creates and also the accessibility that

  • it creates, so make music. Even if you're not feeling like you're someone who could

  • sing in a choir, make music, sing in the shower. When you're on the TTC, sing and see what

  • people think. Maybe that's not a good example, but find places where you can be musically

  • active. If you're not comfortable doing that with others, find private time to make music,

  • whether it's to bang along on a drum or on some pots and pans while you're listening

  • to your favorite music, whether it's singing in the shower or singing in the car, singing

  • along when you have some private time.

  • CP: The singing part and the making music, the beating out the rhythm or dancing to the

  • rhythm, that's... The more that you're doing, the more parts of your brain are benefiting

  • and being exercised. Just like physical exercise, that brain exercise is gonna do good things

  • for you. So make music, listen to music consciously, and consciously is the important part. Just

  • putting on the radio and then mindlessly doing the dishes, you're not really exercising there,

  • you're just kind of...

  • CP: It's like standing on the treadmill without walking. You've got the tool there, but you're

  • not really using the tool. So actually sitting down, putting on music intentionally, whether

  • it's classical music that you've been meaning to listen to or your favorite... I don't know,

  • your favorite Justin Bieber CD, choose something for the moment that you really want to listen

  • to, put the music on and sit down and listen to it. Don't do anything else but listen to

  • the music and see what you notice about the music. Where do you feel the music in your

  • body? How do you experience that music? That's how you're gonna listen consciously, that's

  • how your brain is going to get the most out of the music that you're listening to. Learn

  • an instrument, and I would say 90 percent of the people that I have talked to who are

  • 65 years and older, let's say, say, "Learn an instrument? Why would I do that? I've never

  • played an instrument. It's too late to learn an instrument. Why would I wanna do that?"

  • Well it's not too late. I've had a few clients who have come to the Music Therapy Center

  • saying, "I really would love to play the guitar, but I don't want to have to go through all

  • those lessons and I just want to make it sound good. How can I do that?"

  • CP: And I've worked with many people where I've said, "You don't need to know what all

  • these strings need. Give me some stickers, I'll show you where to put your fingers. That's

  • gonna make a beautiful chord. And then I'll show you how to make the next chord. And you

  • can go back and forth between those two chords and sing probably most of the popular music

  • from the 1940s."

  • CP: So there are ways to learn musical instruments without having to take role conservatory music

  • lessons and practising scales and learning all of the technique. That's not the only

  • way to learn music, so... And there are places out there in Toronto that will teach music

  • in sort of non-conventional way. So if you are interested in learning an instrument,

  • I would encourage you to talk to the music schools and say, "I really wanna learn how

  • to play the banjo, but I'm not interested in learning the technique. I just want to

  • know how to make it sound good. Can you help me to do that?" Hopefully they say yes, or

  • if they say no, ask them for a recommendation. "Do you know of anybody who would help me

  • with that?" "Yes."

  • S?: The Beat Goes On is a band...

  • CP: The Beat Goes On.

  • S1: And it has three levels; beginner, intermediate...

  • CP: Very neat, yes. So there are different... There's also Choir, Choir, Choir; some of

  • you may have heard of that. So there are different groups in Toronto. We're kinda lucky in this

  • big city, there's lots of opportunities where you can be completely... If you want to call

  • yourself this, you can be completely non-musical and go and participate and nobody's going

  • to fault you for that. So find a way to learn a new instrument. Singing is a new instrument.

  • If you have never been a singer before, learning how to use your voice.

  • CP: Some people think, "I don't need a teacher for that." You'd be surprised at what going

  • and working with a music therapist or working with a music teacher can do to help you to

  • use your voice in a way that's gonna be much more therapeutic than doing it on your own.

  • So there are some things you could do on your own. When might you want to seek a music therapist?

  • So you've been doing the music thing or maybe you're not sure about the music thing on your

  • own. It might be worth seeking a music therapist if you are trying to work through something

  • difficult. It's kind of the difference between talking to your friend and talking to a talk

  • therapist, or exercising at the gym versus working with a personal trainer, or working

  • with a physiotherapist. If there's something that you're really wanting to work through,

  • it's worth it to seek a music therapist and see if they can help you.

  • CP: They have the training to help you explore things, to resolve some personal issues, maybe

  • even things you didn't know that you were struggling with. If it's things around end-of-life,

  • helping you to create a legacy through music, it's a wonderful way to work through those

  • kinds of challenges. Also to help you and support you to focus on wellness. I know for

  • me, exercising doesn't happen unless I have support. The music part, that's easy for me,

  • I can do that by myself. Although I have worked with music therapists, we help each other

  • out as well. So know when you need support and you need help to work on being more well.

  • If it's something you're not motivated to do, then you definitely should seek out a

  • music therapist, have some sessions, see what that does for you. You may... Maybe you only

  • need two sessions to get you going and help you create a wellness plan, or maybe seeing

  • someone once a week becomes part of your weekly routine that you really benefit from. So no

  • matter what stage of life you're at, whether you have a challenge or an impairment, or

  • whether you're a healthy person, no matter what you're going through, consider music

  • therapy as something that is an option. It's something that is a tool that you can use.

  • CP: If you have loved ones who are going through challenges, certainly help them to explore

  • it as well, it could be useful for someone that you know, and I hope that in the future,

  • when you're looking at resources for yourself, certainly come back to this and consider that

  • this might be an option. So I think at that point, I'm gonna open it up for some questions.

  • Greg has a microphone so maybe if you have a question, you could put your hand up and

  • he can come and find you. I'm also gonna put some handouts just at the front of the stage

  • so if you do have to get up and leave and you'd like one, just come up and get one.

  • S?: Hi, thank you very much. The presentation was very informative and enlightening. Can

  • I ask you about the service that you provide? If I were to call you as a therapist, where

  • are you located? And do you determine with each person how many sessions they need or

  • is there a standard group program where you're there several times? Thank you.

  • CP: So it really varies. So again, I have two jobs, I work at Baycrest. Now to access

  • music therapy at Baycrest, you have to be a patient or a resident. So if that's not

  • the case, then my other job at the Music Therapy Center is really open for anybody who's interested

  • in music therapy and you work with your therapist to determine what you need, how much of it

  • you need, how regularly you need it. It's really individualized for each person or each

  • group.

  • S?: Yeah, yeah. Hi, I'm wondering... I used to hear that music like the music of Bach

  • had... It was scientifically proven to be actually beneficial, healing perhaps even.

  • Has there been more research done on Bach or other kinds of musics that supports that?

  • CP: Great question. Immediately when you said that, I thought about the Mozart effect, which

  • was really big a few... 12 or 13 years ago, they had the CDs for children to help them

  • learn better. It was called the Mozart Effect. And I think what... It's important to understand

  • two things: Number one, they're doing research on lots of different kinds of music and no

  • matter what kind of music it is, it depends on how you enjoy the music. So the pleasure

  • part of it, the part of your brain that says, "I like this, I want more of it," is more

  • important than the actual music. So if you're listening to Bach and you're going, "Oh my

  • gosh, when is this CD gonna be over," or, "When can I leave this concert," it's probably

  • not gonna be super useful for you. If you love Bach, then absolutely.

  • CP: I think the benefits of... Western classical music is special because it has so many layers.

  • There's so many different instruments being played. When you look at the score that the

  • composer writes, it's miles long with all the different textures and instruments that

  • you're hearing. That does make classical music special, it does offer sort of a special way

  • that is different from listening to popular music you hear on the radio, where it's really

  • about the bass, beat, and the melody. You've got those two layers versus possibly 50 layers.

  • CP: So certainly, I think there is a lot of research looking at the complexity of classical

  • music and how that impacts the brain and how it benefits the brain. But most importantly,

  • if you're listening to it and you don't like it, it's probably not gonna be a big benefit

  • for you. Yeah, thank you.

  • S?: Hi. How do you work with somebody who is resistant to music? So for example, if

  • you turn on the music station that is just on the radio, and he will turn it off.

  • CP: So the question is working with someone who usually will turn off music. First, the

  • easy answer is if someone really isn't enjoying it, then music therapy maybe isn't for them.

  • I've never had that happen, but I think it could happen. If someone really is not a person

  • who [A], is open to interacting with music or listening to music, that would be a challenge.

  • However, when I go and meet new clients, I usually go without music. I don't turn on

  • the radio, I don't put music on a CD player, I don't bring my guitar, I don't play the

  • piano, I go and I talk to them first. Even if they're someone with an impairment, I'll

  • go and I'll talk to them first and try to get to know them a little bit and see how

  • comfortable they are with me.

  • CP: And if I can get a little bit of trust from that person before I suggest music, that

  • sometimes opens the door. I have found with people who have impairments, that instinct

  • to turn the music off is sometimes impaired as well. So it can sometimes open the door

  • a little bit easier if the impairment sort of helps me to get through that door, but

  • certainly, there are people who music therapy is maybe not for them, and if they're resistant

  • to it, they're not gonna benefit from it. So I might try meeting with them a few times

  • to see if they'll become comfortable with me and trust me to try a few things. And after

  • I've done that, then you wanna respect their wishes and say, "Okay, this isn't for you

  • maybe." You're welcome.

  • S?: Hi. Good evening.

  • CP: Hi.

  • S?: Excuse me, my voice is a little...

  • [chuckle]

  • S?: But here we go. My question is for you. Looking at the slide in front of us, there's

  • a conductor. Now...

  • CP: That's me up there.

  • S?: Right. Well done.

  • [laughter]

  • S?: Now, I'm a little intrigued as to... Well, my question actually goes with the, obviously,

  • learning to play an instrument. Where, basically, locally could you learn to be a conductor?

  • CP: Ah, interesting question. So the picture that you're seeing up there with my hands

  • waving in the air, that's the choir I was talking about earlier at Baycrest. It's a

  • community music therapy group. The goals are very broad. It's not as... We're not as interested

  • in tracking things as we are the experience, and something the group decided to take on

  • together was to create a CD. So what you're seeing is us creating... Or recording, rather,

  • a CD that was produced, and conducting, in and of itself, I've often had clients who

  • I put a conductor's baton in their hand, and even if they've never held one, that instinct

  • to move your hand with the baton is incredible.

  • CP: No matter what culture you come from, no matter how young or old you are, for some

  • reason, if music is happening and a baton is placed in your hand, it's kind of an instinct,

  • I have no idea why, to move the baton or to move your hand. Now, if you're asking me where

  • can you go to learn how to conduct, I would say you'd have to find a special music school

  • that would be open to doing that with you. And truthfully, I have no idea offhand. I've

  • never had someone ask that before. But I think there's a few schools, one that comes to mind

  • is called The Toronto Institute for the Enjoyment of Music. It's a big title.

  • CP: It's on Queen West, and they're one of those schools that's really open to teaching

  • in non-conventional ways and they might find your request intriguing. And most music teachers

  • would have had... Even in my music therapy degree, I had to take an conducting course,

  • so if you've done a degree in music, then you've had at least a beginner's introduction

  • to conducting. So there may be music teachers out there that would say, "Yeah, awesome.

  • I would love to teach you to conduct." Alternatively, if you're looking at working on some some

  • stuff through the conducting, a music therapist could definitely work with you.

  • S?: Getting back to the gentlemans' question about the music of Bach. I read an interesting

  • article in Epoch newspaper, you may have heard of that, it's all over and it's a free thing.

  • It's Chinese... Or English. Or Canadian-Chinese, American-Chinese, but there was a very interesting

  • article by a neurologist who was an opera singer. Have you heard of her? She did research

  • and came to the conclusion... All research, I suppose, is tentative conclusions, but nonetheless,

  • that Baroque music was the most desirable for people with Alzheimer's because it did

  • not have that much emotional content compared to, let's say, Beethoven or Strauss or what

  • have you. And I thought that was very interesting and I wonder if you know anything more about

  • that.

  • CP: I have never even heard of this person, but now I'm going to look her up because that

  • is really fascinating. You know what? I would have to say that there's so much research

  • happening on different composers, and the theme is that they find out that music does

  • good things. And so, no matter which composer I'm reading about or which performer is performing

  • the music, I think the general theme is that I've never heard one researcher say that that

  • music doesn't do interesting things to the brain.

  • CP: So I think no matter what you're looking at... I think she's probably right, she probably

  • looked at how people with dementia respond to the music, they probably responded positively

  • to the music. And her theory is that it's because the music is like this. My personal

  • opinion is that she would probably find that with other composers too, but maybe more or

  • less depending on the personal preferences of the subjects that she's studying.

  • CP: So it's a good point for when you're looking at your own music. Listen to Bach. How do

  • you feel about it when you listen to it? How does it impact you as a person? And if you're

  • thinking about putting together some personal play-lists as you get older and you wanna

  • make sure you've got the right music, maybe you add Bach to the list because that research

  • resonates with you, and you listen to the music and you think, "Yeah, what she said

  • makes a lot of sense."

  • CP: But, yeah. I'm not speaking from my own research, but from my personal experiences.

  • There are lots and lots of studies that say, "Beethoven is good. Bach is good. Mozart does

  • this." And I think all of it is true and I think probably you could lump it into a great

  • big pot that says, "Wow, music does incredible things to the brain." And then I would pull

  • over the other pot that says, "You gotta like the music." If it's something that isn't pleasing

  • or doesn't turn on the pleasure center in the brain, then all of the results she would

  • have, would have gone blah. Yeah.

  • S?: Yeah, thanks very much for a very informative and useful presentation on the obviously rapidly

  • evolving state of knowledge and practice, in terms of musical therapy, at least, for

  • those of us who are in our final quarter, shall we say.

  • [chuckle]

  • S?: I'm expecting... Next time I walk by the Royal Conservatory, I'll see they're promoting

  • the advantages of music in the later stages of life. They haven't yet got to that point,

  • but I expect any day now. So I have two questions, one specific and one general. One, is there

  • any evidence in recent research that, for people with mild cognitive disorder, musical

  • therapy will create new memories or would help in the rewiring?

  • CP: Right. That's a great question. I don't know if everybody heard that, that... Can

  • we create new memories for people who have mild cognitive impairment? I will speak from

  • a couple of research articles that say maybe, [chuckle] and then I'll speak from my personal

  • experience and there are a couple of community groups that I work with where it's the same

  • people that come every week. When you have that consistency, when you're working with

  • people at the same time, week after week, even if they have that impairment, it becomes

  • familiar. So they may not remember my name, but they remember that... They recognize me

  • and that they're there for music and this is the routine.

  • CP: What I find incredible is that if we've been, perhaps, using a song that one person

  • has never sung before, or doesn't know, but it's someone else's favorite, after repeating

  • that song week after week, suddenly the people who didn't know that song can sing it without

  • me prompting them with the words or without me starting the song. To give you an example,

  • there was a guy in the group, I don't remember his name, but he came in and he hated, hated

  • the song Mack the Knife.

  • [chuckle]

  • CP: I don't know why he hated it, but another group member, it was their favorite song.

  • So of course as the music therapist, I'm saying, "Okay, so let's figure out a way that we can

  • work with this. This guy loves it, this guy hates it. We're gonna include it, but we're

  • gonna recognize that you don't like it and that's okay." And after about five or six

  • weeks, the gentleman who hated it and didn't know any of the words 'cause he never listened

  • to it, didn't really familiarize himself with it, came in and he saw the other guy and he

  • said... He remembered his name. I don't remember it right now, but let's say it's Joe, and

  • he said, "Hey, Joe, 'When the clock strikes half past 6:00, babe,'" and started singing

  • and then he kind of... It petered off and he lost track of it.

  • CP: But I think absolutely, with consistency... It has to be consistent and with a familiar

  • pattern, I think... I would say from experience, absolutely we form new memories. Whether that

  • transfers into other contexts or not, I don't know. So whether he would have remembered

  • those lyrics outside of the context of the group that we were in, I have no idea, but

  • certainly in that moment, nothing triggered that memory except his own doing. So I think...

  • There's more research being done, but absolutely I think new musical... Especially musical

  • memories can be formed.

  • S?: And the second part is, in the wider view, from an evolutionary standpoint, man being

  • somewhat unique in its... In our musical abilities and interests and delights, does this confer

  • some particular advantage? Or is it just an adjunct of our large cortex in which case

  • the birds of course do it well with a very small brain?

  • CP: Yeah, absolutely. I'm trying to remember what kind of... It must've been a neuro-researcher

  • who actually looked at birdsong and how we hear birdsong and how it's different in the

  • birds' brain than it is in our brain. I think the big difference between now and then is

  • we know more about it. I think... With children, for example, who nobody's taught them anything

  • yet, they are just sort of instinctively musical. And now what we know about how we... Our brains

  • work and our bodies work, we know that everybody's musical, whether they like the sound of their

  • voice or not. We are musical beings, so I think historically, there weren't those inhibitions,

  • there weren't those rules around what it should sound like or what the experience should be.

  • And it's really fascinating how, over time, things shift with humans, but they're the

  • same with the birds, they're the same with the animals, and that's been going on for

  • as long as the bird has been going on. So humans are kind of unique in that way where,

  • over the decades, over the years, the rules shift and the social norms shift, and what's

  • good and what's not good shifts. The birds always sound the way the birds should sound,

  • for sure. Thank you.

Speaker 1: Good afternoon, everyone. Thank you all for coming out. Today, our program

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音楽療法とエイジング|ベイクレスト|2016年6月9日|アトリウム (Music Therapy and Aging | Baycrest | June 9, 2016 | Atrium)

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