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  • >> TONIGHT, ON INSIGHTS ON PBS HAWAII, DURING THIS LEGISLATIVE SESSION, CIVIL LIBERTIES

  • ADVOCATES AND DRUG POLICY REFORMERS LOBBIED FOR THE DECRIMINALIZATION OF MARIJUANA, JOIN

  • THE DEBATE ABOUT EASING THE PENALTIES ON MARIJUANA USE.

  • NOW, LIVE IN OUR STUDIO, OUR HOST, DAN BOYLAN. >>DAN: ALOHA AROUND WELCOME TO INSIGHTS ON

  • PBS HAWAII. IM DAN BOYLAN.

  • A RECENT PEW RESEARCH POLL REPORTS THAT A MAJORITY OF AMERICANS APPROVE OF THE LEGALIZATION

  • OF MARIJUANA. THIS SHIFT IN PUBLIC OPINION WAS FORECAST

  • THIS PAST NOVEMBER WHEN VOTERS IN THE STATES OF WASHINGTON AND COLORADO APPROVED BALLOT

  • INITIATIVES LEGALIZING POT. WHILE STILL ILLEGAL FOR RECREATIONAL USE,

  • MARIJUANA USE FOR MEDICINAL PURPOSES IS LEGAL IN HAWAII AND 17 OTHER STATES.

  • HAWAII LAWMAKERS THIS SESSION DEBATED MARIJUANA RELATED BILLS THAT RANGE FROM ITS LEGALIZATION

  • TO REDUCTIONS OF THE PUNISHMENT FOR POSSESSION OF UP TO 20 GRAMS.

  • THATS 47 TO 50 MARIJUANA CIGARETTES. RIGHT?

  • FROM A PETTY MISDEMEANOR TO A $100 CIVIL FINE. A BILL TO TRANSFER THE MEDICAL MARIJUANA PROGRAM

  • FROM THE STATE DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY TO THE DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH IS STILL PENDING.

  • TONIGHT, WELL EXPLORE THE FATE OF THE PROPOSED LEGISLATION AS WELL AS EXAMINE CURRENT MEDICAL

  • LAWS AND MEDICAL MARIJUANAS USE IN HAWAII. WE INVITE YOU TO JOIN THE CONVERSATION BY

  • CALLING, E MAILING OR TWEETING YOUR QUESTIONS AND COMMENTS.

  • OR YOU CAN JOIN OUR LIVE BLOG. THE CONTACT INFORMATION YOU NOW SEE ON YOUR

  • SCREEN WILL BE SHOWN REGULARLY THROUGHOUT THE PROGRAM.

  • INSIGHTS IS ALSO STREAMING LIVE ON OUR COMPUTER AND WILL BE POSTED ON OUR WEBSITE AFTER THE

  • BROADCAST. NOW TO OUR PANEL.

  • PAMELA LICHTY IS THE PRESIDENT OF THE DRUG POLICY ACTION GROUP WHICH FOCUSES ON SERVES

  • AS A BOARD MEMBER OF THE DRUG POLICY ALLIANCE. A NATIONAL ORGANIZATION THAT PROMOTES ALTERNATIVES

  • TO CURRENT DRUG POLICIES. SHES ALSO ON THE BOARD OF THE DIRECTORS OF

  • THE AMERICAN CIVIL LIBERTIES UNION OF HAWAII. PAM HOLDS MASTERS DEGREE IN PUBLIC HEALTH.

  • ALAN SHINN IS THE EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF THE NONPROFIT COALITION FOR A DRUG FREE HAWAII,

  • WHICH WAS FORMED IN 1987. CDFHS MISSION IS TO REDUCE OR PREVENT DRUG

  • ABUSE THROUGH COLLABORATIVE EFFORTS BY EDUCATORS AND SOCIAL SERVICE PROVIDERS.

  • ALAN HAS SERVED ON THE HONOLULU MAYORS DRUG TASK FORCE AS WELL AS OTHER ORGANIZATIONS

  • ADDRESSING SUBSTANCE ABUSE. ALAN HOLDS A MASTERS DEGREE IN SOCIAL WORK.

  • CHARLES WEBB IS A PARTICIPATING MEDICAL MARRIAGE PHYSICIAN LOCATED ON THE BIG ISLAND AND THE

  • FOUNDER OF THE MEDICAL USE OF MARIJUANA CLINIC OR MUM HAWAII.

  • DRWEBB ALSO PRACTICES URGENT CARE MEDICINE AND WAS AN EMERGENCY ROOM PHYSICIAN FOR OVER

  • 30 YEARS. JAMES HOCHBERG IS PRESIDENT OF THE HAWAII

  • FAMILY ADVOCATES, A NONPROFIT LEGISLATIVE ACTION ARM OF THE HAWAII FAMILY FORUM.

  • ITS MISSION IS TO EDUCATE, LOBBY, FOR LEGISLATION AND PARTICIPATE IN THE POLITICAL ACTIVITIES

  • THAT ADVANCE THE INTERESTS OF FAMILIES, FAITH AND FREEDOM.

  • JIM IS AN ATTORNEY. WELL, IF THIS WAS THE YEAR FOR THE LEGALIZATION

  • OF MAYOR OF MARIJUANA, ATTA LEAST ELECTIONS IN POLLS THAT SHOW THAT OPINION FOR IT SEEMS

  • TO BE RISING, WHY DIDNT IT GET ANYWHERE IN THIS SESSION OF THE LEGISLATURE?

  • PAM, YOU WATCH THIS FAIRLY CLOSELY. >> I WATCH IT VERY CLOSELY.

  • FIRST OF ALL, I WANT TO SAY THANKS FOR HAVING ALL OF US HERE TONIGHT.

  • THIS IS A REALLY TIMELY DISCUSSION. AND WERE PLEASED THAT HAWAII IS FINALLY HAVING

  • A SERIOUS CONVERSATION ABOUT MARIJUANA. THE JOKING HAS KIND OF STOPPED AN PEOPLE ARE

  • LOOK AT IT SERIOUSLY. THERE WERE ABOUT 20 BILLS INTRODUCED THIS

  • SESSION. ON ALL ASPECTS OF MARIJUANA.

  • INDICATING THAT THE INTEREST LEVEL THAT IS OUT THERE.

  • AS YOU SAID, COLORADO AND WASHINGTON STATE TAKING THE BOLD MOVE TO LEGALIZE IT THROUGH

  • VOTER INITIATIVES REALLY KIND OF SET THE STAGE IN A LOT OF OTHER STATES ARE NOW LOOKING TO

  • SEE WHAT THEY CAN DO TO REFORM WHAT THEY SEE AS NONFUNCTIONAL LAWS.

  • 16 STATES HAVE ALREADY DECRIMINALIZED INCLUDING SOME SURPRISING ONES, LIKE MISSISSIPPI, OHIO,

  • NEBRASKA, AND. >>DAN: WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY DECRIMINALIZE?

  • >> OKAY. IN SOME STATES, ITS A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT,

  • BUT GENERALLY, IT MEANS REMOVING CRIMINAL PENALTYINGS FOR POSSESSION OF A SMALL A, THE

  • AMOUNT VARIES FROM STATE TO STATE. AROUND REPLACING IT WITH A CIVIL FINE.

  • CITATION LIKE A PARKING TICKET. AND USUALLY, FINE OF USUALLY $100 IS THE AVERAGE

  • AND ONE OUNCE IS ABOUT THE AVERAGE AMOUNT THATS PERMITTED.

  • >>DAN: WE HAVE NOT DONE THAT? >> NO.

  • WE HAVE NOT. >>DAN: IS THERE ANY  THERES NOTHING STILL

  • ALIVE AT THE LEGISLATURE THAT WOULD INDICATE WERE GOING TO DO IT THIS YEAR?

  • >> WELL, YOU KNOW, THINGS CAN HAPPEN AT THE LAST MINUTES, BUT IT LOOKS LIKE NO.

  • IT WENT THROUGH THE SENATE WHERE IT PASSED UNANIMOUSLY.

  • BILL I WILL TO DECRIMINALIZE. THEN IT OVER TO THE HOUSE, THROUGH SEVERAL

  • COMMITTEES ALL THE WAY TO THE FLOOR OF THE HOUSE AND THEY VOTED TO RECOMMIT IT TO COMMITTEE.

  • TO THE JUDICIARY COMMITTEE THE LAST ONE. THAT MEANS THEY DIDNT THINK THEY HAD THE VOTES

  • TO PASS IT. BUT NEITHER DID ANYONE HAVE TO GO ON RECORD

  • TO SAY WHERE THEY STOOD. >>DAN: ALAN SHINN, WHY DONT YOU WANT THESE

  • BILLS TO PASS? WHY SHOULDNT WE LEGALIZE IT.

  • >> I THINK MARIJUANA IS A HEALTH PROBLEM FOR HAWAII AND I THINK LEGALIZATION IS WHAT HAPPENS

  • WHEN PEOPLE ARE NOT REALLY INFORMED ABOUT THE DRUG.

  • SO I THINK THE PAST ATTITUDES AND OPINIONS ABOUT MARIJUANA, THERES A LOT OF MISCONCEPTIONS

  • AND I WOULD SAY THAT ITS A MAJOR PROBLEM IN TERMS OF TRYING TO EDUCATE PEOPLE AND CATCH

  • THEM UP BECAUSE I THINK MANY OF OUR OPINIONS AND FEELINGS ABOUT MARIJUANA GO WAY BACK TO

  • I THINK IN THE SIXTIES AND SEVENTIES. WITH ALL THE SCIENCE BASED INFORMATION THAT

  • WE NOW HAVE ON MARIJUANA, WE HAVENT, OUR OPINIONS AND FEELINGS ABOUT IT HAVE NOT REALLY CAUGHT

  • UP WITH THE TECHNOLOGY AND THE SCIENCE THAT WE HAVE.

  • >>DAN: WHAT SCIENCE SPECIFICALLY, I CAN SAY THAT WORD, ARE YOU REFERRING TO THAT SAYS

  • THAT MARIJUANA IS A HEALTH PROBLEM, THAT ITS GOING TO CAUSE US TROUBLE?

  • >> WE HAVE TO LOOK AT MARIJUANA LIKE WE LOOK AT OTHER DRUGS.

  • ITS A PUBLIC HEALTH ISSUE. THERE ARE HARMFUL EFFECTS OF ANY DRUG, BUT

  • FOR MARIJUANA, WE KNOW THAT ITS LINKED TO ASSOCIATED WITH PSYCHOSIS, DEPRESSION AND

  • PARANOIA. IM TALKING ABOUT CHRONIC PERSISTENT USE OF

  • HIGH GRADE POTENT MARIJUANA THAT WE HAVE NOWADAYS. ITS NOT SAME MARIJUANA THAT OUR MAYBE WE SMOKED,

  • DAN, YOU AND I SMOKED WAY BACK IN THE DAYS. >>DAN: NOT ME.

  • MAYBE YOU. NOT ME.

  • >> SO POTENCY IS NOW MUCH HIGHER. MARIJUANA HAS BEEN GMOD AND NOW, WE HAVE POTENCY

  • LEVELS THAT ARE 10 TIMES WHAT IT WAS IN THE SIXTIES AND 70S.

  • >>DAN: IS THAT TRUE? I READ SOMETHING ON THAT TOO.

  • THEY SEEM TO INDICATE IT IS MORE POTENT. >> WELL, THIS IS MISERY.

  • THE PEOPLE WHO ARE OPPOSED TO MARIJUANA PRETEND THAT ITS DANGEROUS BECAUSE ITS PERHAPS BEEN

  • IMPROVED FROM 4% TO 8% THC. THATS WHEN THEYRE TALKING ABOUT.

  • >>DAN: THC IS  >> PSYCHO ACTIVE CHEMICAL IN MARIJUANA.

  • OR CANNABIS, IF WERE TALKING MEDICALLY, THE PROPER WORD WOULD BE CANNABIS.

  • MARIJUANA COVERS IT. ANYWAY, THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT, THE DEA ACTUALLY

  • BRAGS ABOUT HOW EFFECTIVE 100% THC. MARINOL PILLS AND TRIES TO GET US TO BELIEVE

  • THAT 8% IS DANGEROUS WHILE 100% IS PERFECTLY FINE IN PILL FORM.

  • SO THERES A DOUBLE STANDARD. IN FACT, THE WHOLE HISTORY OF MARIJUANA REPRESENTS

  • A DOUBLE STANDARD. IT WAS ORIGINALLY MADE ILLEGAL BECAUSE MUCH

  • PEOPLE WITH COLOR. MEXICANS AND BLACK MUSICIANS AND BLACK PEOPLE,

  • IT WAS DEFINITELY MADE TO HURT THESE PEOPLE. IT STILL DOES.

  • THATS WHOS IN JAIL NOW BECAUSE OF IN ARE HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE OF COLOR, YOUNG PEOPLE

  • AND IT RUINS THEIR LIFE. HEALTH HAZARDS, I WILL NOT BE ABLE TO NAME.

  • I ADDRESS THE PSYCHOSIS THING IF YOU LIKE. THATS MANY OF THE THINGS BROUGHT UP THAT ARE

  • FAULTS. >>DAN: I HAVE READ A LITTLE BIT ON IT.

  • AS I UNDERSTAND IT, IT CAN BE ADDICTIVE IN ONE ON ONE IN 11 USERS?

  • >> HAWAII MEDICAL ASSOCIATION HAS RESOLUTION WHICH SAYS THAT IT IS MINIMALLY OR NONADDICTIVE

  • AND THEY RECOMMEND THAT IT BE DOWN SCHEDULED SO THAT IT CAN BE PROPRESCRIBED.

  • PERHAPS HE KNOWS MORE THAN THE HAWAII MEDICAL ASSOCIATION ON THERE, BUT I REALLY DOUBT IT.

  • >> GO HAD HE HAD. >> 2011, THE DEA WAS PETITIONED TO UNSCHEDULE

  • IT AS A SCHEDULE 1 DRUG. BASED ON SCIENTIFIC EVIDENCE, THEY DECLINED.

  • SO I WOULD THINK THAT THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT REGULATORS OF MARIJUANA THAT REQUIRE THAT

  • IT BE SCHEDULE 1 DRUG WOULD KNOW WHAT THEYRE TALKING ABOUT.

  • >>DAN: DOESNT THE SCIENCE SAY SOMETHING ABOUT IF KIDS USE IT VERY YOUNG, THERES A DANGER?

  • IN FACT, SOME OF THE DECRIMINALIZATION SAID ITS DECRIMINALIZED FOR PEOPLE OVER 21.

  • ISNT THAT RIGHT? WHERE COLORADO AND WASHINGTON HAS GONE?

  • >> RIGHT. ISNT THAT BASED ON SCIENCE?

  • >> NO. ITS BASED ON GUESS WORK BECAUSE NONE OF US

  • WANT OUR CHILDREN DOING COFFEE. NONE OF US WANT OUR CHILDREN DOING CIGARETTES.

  • WE DONT WANT OUR CHILDREN DOING PSYCHO ACTIVE DRUGS EVEN THOUGH WE SOMETIMES LET THEM DRINK

  • DRPEPPER AND COCA COLA COULD A FULL OF CAFFEINE.

  • FEDERAL GOVERNMENT DID NOT BASE THEIR STUDIES ON SCIENCE.

  • IT WAS PURE POLITICS. JUDGE SAID IT SHOULD BE DOWN SCHEDULED AND

  • THEY HAVE NO SCIENCE. THIS WAS FEDERAL COURT AND I HAD ENTIRE FEDERAL

  • BRIEF IN THE DEA. HERES WHAT THEY SAID ABOUT PSYCHOSIS.

  • IF FROM THE FED DATA. DOES NOT SUGGEST A CAUSATIVE LINK BETWEEN

  • THE MARIJUANA USE AND DEVELOPMENT OF PSYCHOSIS. IF I GIVE AWE SHOT OF CORE ZONE, HERES THE

  • THING FROM THE FLIER, CAN LEAD TO FRANK PSYCHOTIC MANIFESTATIONS, EMOTIONAL INSTABILITY OR TSAI

  • COULD THE PARTICULAR TENDENCIES MAY BE AGGREGATED BY CORTICOSTEROIDS.

  • KNOWN AS STEROID RAGE. THERES AUTOMOBILE A DOUBLE STANDARDS HERE.

  • USUALLY HYPOTHETICAL DANGERS OF MARIJUANA BUT THEY NEVER HAVE THE STUDIES OR STUDIES

  • TO SHOW DANGER. WERE TALKING ABOUT A PILL THATS LESS ADDICTING

  • THAN CAFFEINE AND SAFER THAN TILE NOT AND ASPIRIN AND YET THEY HAVE IT CLASSIFIED AND

  • TREATED AS MORE DANGEROUS THAN HEROIN. THERES NO SCIENCE THERE.

  • PURE POLITICS AND THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT HAS BEEN VERY DISINGENUOUS.

  • >> DAN, THE CONTROLLED SUBSTANCES ACT MANDATES THAT THE SCHEDULING AND APPROVAL OF DRUGS

  • INCLUDING MARIJUANA MUST BE DONE ON BOTH LEGAL AND SCIENTIFIC BASIS.

  • SO IF THEYRE NOT FOLLOWING THE STATUTE AND MAKING POLITICAL DECISIONS, I WOULDNT THINK

  • THATS WHATS GOING ON. >> STUDIES, THERES BEEN LONG TERM STUDIES

  • ABOUT THE EFFECTIVE MARIJUANA ON ESPECIALLY YOUNG PEOPLE.

  • UNDER 18. AND SHOWN THAT THERE IS SCIENCE, THERE ARE

  • CORRELATES TO MEMORY LOSS, LEARNING DISABILITIES, AND IT GOES ON AND ON.

  • SO I THINK THAT THERE ARE STUDIES THAT REALLY SHOW THAT, DRWEBB.

  • >> IF YOU WANT TO PROTECT THE CHILDREN, YOU HAVE TO BE HONEST.

  • AND THE PROBLEMS HERE ARE NUMBER ONE, IF YOU LIE TO THE CHILDREN AND TELL THEM MARIJUANA

  • IS DANGEROUS WHICH I WAS LIED TO AND IT MADE ME VERY SKEPTICAL.

  • I DIDNT BELIEVE THE OTHER THINGS THEY TOLD ME BECAUSE THEY WERE DISHONEST TO ME AND TOLD

  • ME MARIJUANA WAS DANGEROUS. THE OTHER THING IS ITS ALREADY AVAILABLE EVERYWHERE.

  • MY 3 KIDS ALL WENT TO HIGH SCHOOL ON A MILITARY ACADEMY AND THEY COULD GET ANY DRUG THEY WANTED

  • AT SCHOOL. PROHIBITION MEANS THE DEALER GETS TO DECIDE

  • WHO DOES IT RATHER THAN THE GOVERNMENT. AND I DONT KNOW.

  • THATS NOT WHAT I WANT. >> OUR AGENCY DOES PREVENTION.

  • WILLS DO TREATMENT. WE WORK WITH JUVENILE DRUG COURT.

  • MANY OF THE KIDS WHO COME IN, YOUTH WHO COME IN HAVE PROBLEMS WITH DRUGS OBVIOUSLY.

  • AND MARIJUANA IS USUALLY ONE OF THEM. WE SEE A LOT OF PROBLEMS AROUND THEIR CHRONIC

  • USE OF MARIJUANA. FUNCTIONING LEVELS, JUST THEIR BEHAVIOR, LOWER

  • FUNCTIONING. THEY HAVE A PROBLEM WITH.

  • >> JUST LIKE ANY OTHER DRUG. >> IF YOU WANT THE USE TO GO DOWN, IT GOES

  • DOWN IN COUNTRIES WHERE IT HAS BEEN DECRIMINALIZED. IN HOLLAND, THEY HAVE SINGLE DIGIT TEEN USE.

  • WE HAVE A WAR ON DRUGS AND WE HAVE 30 SOME% TEEN USE F YOU REALLY WANT TEEN USE AND YOUTH

  • USE TO GO DOWN, YOU LEGALIZE IT AND REGULATE IT.

  • >> I WAS GOING TO SAY THAT I THINK WE COULD GO ON ALL NIGHT WITH DULYING STUDIES.

  • STUDIES THAT SHOW TOTALLY OPPOSITE THINGS. ID LIKE TO STIPULATE AS A PUBLIC HEALTH PERSON

  • THAT ALL PSYCHO ACTIVE DRUGS HAVE SOME DEGREE OF ARM.

  • ITS A MATTER OF DEGREE. SO I THINK OUR ARGUMENT IS THAT WERE ALREADY

  • REGULATING ALCOHOL AND TOBACCO WHICH ARE OBJECTIVELY FAR MORE HARMFUL.

  • AND SO WHY ARE WE TREATING THIS AS SOMETHING THAT IS BEYOND THE PALE?

  • SOME OF THE CRITERIA GET FEDERAL GOVERNMENT USES FOR SCHEDULING, FOR SOMETHING TO BE SCHEDULE

  • 1, WHICH IS THE MOST STRICTEST SCHEDULE T. MEANS THAT IT CANT BE USED FOR RESEARCH UNLESS

  • THE NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF DRUG ABUSE AGREES, WHICH THEY OFTEN DO NOT.

  • AND HAS TO MEET ALL THE 3 CRITERIA. THEY ARE, THAT HAS NO RECOGNIZED MEDICAL VALUE.

  • 18 STATES PLUS DC DISAGREE ABOUT THAT. IT HAS A HIGH POTENTIAL FOR ABUSE.

  • WE CAN ARGUE THAT ONE. BUT ITS AGAIN, A MATTER OF RELATIVE HARM.

  • SO I WOULD SAY. AND THE THIRD CRITERIA IS THAT.

  • >> ITS TOO UNSAFE FOR PHYSICIANS TO PRESCRIBE. WEVE NEVER HAD A DEATH FOR IT.

  • EVERY OTHER THING I CAN PRESCRIBE CAN KILL PEOPLE.

  • EVEN CAFFEINE PEOPLE CAN KILL PEOPLE IN OVERDOSE. NOBODY HAS DIED FROM IT AND THEYRE SAYING

  • ITS TOO DANGEROUS FOR DOCTORS TO PRESCRIBE. THATS NOT SCIENCE.

  • >>DAN: ISNT ONE OF THE ARGUMENTS THAT ITS AN ENTRY LEVEL DRUG?

  • ISNT THAT A FAIRLY COMMON ARGUMENT THAT USED, THAT YOU START WITH MARIJUANA AND THEN YOU

  • HEAD TO METH, I GUESS, AND SO ON. IS THAT  .

  • YEAH. I DONT 

  • >>DAN: ANY VIABILITY. >> I DONT THINK WERE TALKING REFER MADNESS

  • NOWADAYS. THATS GONE.

  • THAT PART IS GONE. I THINK WHAT I THINK WHAT WERE SAYING IS THAT

  • IT CAN BE A GATEWAY DRUG FOR SOME PEOPLE OF THE NOT EVERYBODY.

  • ITS THE WAY YOUR BRAIN IS WIRED. YOUR POTENTIAL FOR ADDICTION, SOMETIMES IS

  • HEREDITARY. BUT YOU KNOW, NOT, I WOULDNT SAY ITS A GATEWAY

  • DRUG FOR EVERYONE. I THINK FOR SOME PEOPLE T. IS.

  • AND WE HAVE PEOPLE THAT HAVE COME THROUGH OUR CLINIC SEEKING ASSISTANCE WHO SAID, YEAH,

  • I STARTED WITH MARIJUANA. AND NOW, IM ON METH OR COCAINE OR HEROIN AND

  • I STARTED WHEN I WAS 15 YEARS OLD. SO YOU SEE THAT PATTERN OF ADDICTION.

  • YOU DO. BUT I MEAN, IN CERTAIN INDIVIDUALS.

  • CERTAINLY. BUT THE GATEWAY THEORY HAS BEEN DISCREDITED

  • FOR A LONG TIME AND REALLY DEFINITIVE ONE WAS IN 1999 WHEN THE INSTITUTE OF MEDICINE

  • ISSUED A REPORT ABOUT THE VARIOUS PROPERTIES OF MARIJUANA AND THEY SAID, THAT THERE IS

  • NO CONCLUSIVE EVIDENCE. QUOTE, DRUG AFFECTS OF MARIJUANA ARE CAUSALLY

  • LINKED TO THE SUBSEQUENT ABUSE OF OTHER ILLICIT DRUGS.

  • YES, THERE MAY BE A PATTERN THAT YOU SEE IN ONE PARTICULAR PERSON THAT THEY START WITH

  • MARIJUANA. WELL, THEY START WITH THAT USUALLY ACTUALLY

  • THEY START WITH ALCOHOL AND NICOTINE. THOSE ARE READILY AVAILABLE.

  • BUT THEY WOULD START WITH MARIJUANA ALMOST NATURALLY BECAUSE ITS THE MOST PREVALENT BY

  • FAR, SOME 10 MILLION AMERICANS STILL USE IT AND I CANT REMEMBER THE FIGURE FOR PEOPLE

  • HAVE USED IT OVER THE YEARS. WITH YOU ITS THE MOST READILY AVAILABLE.

  • SO IT JUST SORT OF MAKES SENSE. BUT THERES OTHER THEORIES TOO.

  • THAT NONCONFORMING TEENAGERS ARE LIKELY TO TRY IT BECAUSE ITS OUT THERE, BECAUSE IT SOUNDS

  • EXCITING, BECAUSE THERES FORBIDDEN FRUIT ANGLE TO IT.

  • AND THE OTHER THING THAT I THINK IS VALID ABOUT THE GATEWAY EFFECT IS THAT IT GIVES

  • THE PERSON WHO IS ACQUIRING THE MARIJUANA EXPOSURE TO THE OTHER DRUGS THAT ARE ON THE

  • BLACK MARKET. SO AND I THINK WE COULD TALK ABOUT ICE AND

  • MARIJUANA IN HAWAII AND THERES KIND OF AN INTERESTING EXAMPLE CASTLE & COOKE THERE.

  • >> THERES ALSO THE CONFORMING TEENAGERS WHO CURRENTLY WOULDNT SMOKE MARIJUANA BECAUSE

  • ITS ILLEGAL AND IF IT WAS LEGALIZED OR DECRIMINALLED, THAT GATE FOR THEM WOULD BE GONE AND I THINK

  • THATS AN IMPORTANT POINT AS WELL. >> ALAN IS HOT GOING BELIEVE ME, BUT I DIDNT

  • USE MARIJUANA VERY MUCH. >> VERY MUCH.

  • >>DAN: AS I TELL PEOPLE. PUT ME TO SLEEP AND THAT WASNT THE WAY I LIKED

  • TO PARTY. I HAVE TALKED TO SOME YOUNG PEOPLE ABOUT THIS.

  • TALKED TO SOME YOUNGER GENERATIONS. I AM SHOCKED BY WHAT JIM SAYS.

  • A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE NOT, A LOT YOUNG PEOPLE ARE NOT USING MARIJUANA.

  • WHILE IVE TALKED TO SOME WHO SAID, DAD, I SAID SOMETHING, EVERYBODY USES MARIJUANA.

  • EVERYBODY IS DOING MARIJUANA. YOU DONT KNOW ANYBODY UNDER A CERTAIN AGE

  • THATS NOT DOING MARIJUANA. I ALSO TALKED TO A LOT OF KIDS WHO ARE NOT

  • DOING IT AND HAVE NO INTENTION OF DOING IT. IF WE PUT IT OUT THERE ALONG WITH THE WINE

  • SHOP AND COFFEE SHOP AND SALOON, ARENT THEY GOING TO BE DOING IT.

  • >> NO. OF THE EXPERIMENT HAS ALREADY BEEN DONE.